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Why does Wargaming allow seal clubbing?


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Silence_I_Keeeel_You #1 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:05

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I know I have only a few battles.  I've played off and on for a few years though.

My game was logging me into the SA server though I'm in Houston, Texas.

Playing on SA is good even vs only bots and the few players with 2-3k battles are managable.

I like the M2 light with the machine gun and it's fun and seems balanced enough kill and being killed.

I understand the M2 is considered overpowered, but it is quite balanced against tier 2 and 3 tanks using regular ammo.

 

Today there were too few players on SA so I switched to USC.

USC is horrible.  All I encounter are players with many thousand battles spamming only premium ammo.

M2 light player rushed-rammed me to death doing 200 damage (spall liner?) shooting apcr and all my shots do is ding off.

I looked at his account after battle.  He has >65000 battles total and >26000 battles IN the M2 light with top damage of over

1000 and 10 kills.  This is the epitome of "seal clubber" and SMURF. How is this type of player fair to new players and why

does wargaming allow, encourage, and reward it?

 

I encounter other such players at tier 3 using FCMPAK40 spamming only HEAT rounds which one shot players. 

And most such players have a couple thousand battles in that PAK40 so again seal clubbing, but that least me to question;

Why is premium ammo even availalble in such tanks?

 

Low tier should not be using premium ammo anyway so we can learn how to aim shots.   I don't use it unless the tank I'm

shooting requires it.  R35 and H35 come to mind as well as M2 lights.

 

This game can be so much fun, but the fun factor dies fast when facing seal clubbers like these players. 

And nearly every battle has one or more than one of them. 

 

If this is what the game will be like moving onto higher tiers just gold spam in tanks already OP what incentive do I have

to continue playing?  I am not planning to purchase any premium tanks or premium time and will not ever given the conditions

I'm experiencing.

 

I think players with more than 1000 battles in a single tank should see no experience, no credits etc from the tank to

make it wholly unprofitable.  Wargaming should charge more for ammo; especially premium on seal clubbing players.

 

Legitimate comments welcomed. Flames will be ignored.  I've read this forum enough to know then difrerence.



MagillaGuerilla #2 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:10

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WG caters to players who spend a lot of money. Those guys with a gazilllion battles that have played for years are WG's cash cows. That's why there is seal clubbing.

SporkBoy #3 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:13

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Play RU servers.

_Tsavo_ #4 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:17

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While I think a possible solution to seal clubbing would be 2 low tier player pools, NA at least doesn't have the population to pull it off.

 

Unfortunately, can't do anything about clubbing.  It won't impress anyone, it's blatantly obvious, and at the day, they aren't breaking any rules and having fun.  Which is kind of the point of playing games.



repsolroger #5 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:18

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Have matchmaker also use personal rating 3500 above/below...so that new players have a chance to actually get to know the game...instead of meeting up with the 4/7 skill enhanced equipment + crew platoons....as for not getting exp after 1000 battles in 1 tank....to many tanks i do like ( but sick of rng ) so i play them over and over...thats why i almost have a 10 skill russian heavy crew.....but that wont happen now cause ive pretty much stopped logging in

dave_292 #6 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:19

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View PostSilence_I_Keeeel_You, on Sep 20 2019 - 07:05, said:

I know I have only a few battles.  I've played off and on for a few years though.

My game was logging me into the SA server though I'm in Houston, Texas.

Playing on SA is good even vs only bots and the few players with 2-3k battles are managable.

I like the M2 light with the machine gun and it's fun and seems balanced enough kill and being killed.

I understand the M2 is considered overpowered, but it is quite balanced against tier 2 and 3 tanks using regular ammo.

 

Today there were too few players on SA so I switched to USC.

USC is horrible.  All I encounter are players with many thousand battles spamming only premium ammo.

M2 light player rushed-rammed me to death doing 200 damage (spall liner?) shooting apcr and all my shots do is ding off.

I looked at his account after battle.  He has >65000 battles total and >26000 battles IN the M2 light with top damage of over

1000 and 10 kills.  This is the epitome of "seal clubber" and SMURF. How is this type of player fair to new players and why

does wargaming allow, encourage, and reward it?

 

I encounter other such players at tier 3 using FCMPAK40 spamming only HEAT rounds which one shot players. 

And most such players have a couple thousand battles in that PAK40 so again seal clubbing, but that least me to question;

Why is premium ammo even availalble in such tanks?

 

Low tier should not be using premium ammo anyway so we can learn how to aim shots.   I don't use it unless the tank I'm

shooting requires it.  R35 and H35 come to mind as well as M2 lights.

 

This game can be so much fun, but the fun factor dies fast when facing seal clubbers like these players. 

And nearly every battle has one or more than one of them. 

 

If this is what the game will be like moving onto higher tiers just gold spam in tanks already OP what incentive do I have

to continue playing?  I am not planning to purchase any premium tanks or premium time and will not ever given the conditions

I'm experiencing.

 

I think players with more than 1000 battles in a single tank should see no experience, no credits etc from the tank to

make it wholly unprofitable.  Wargaming should charge more for ammo; especially premium on seal clubbing players.

 

Legitimate comments welcomed. Flames will be ignored.  I've read this forum enough to know then difrerence.


It is on the list of thing they are concerned about because it prevents new players from even getting started in the game. Because if someone rage quits after 100 game. Wot makes no money. Figuring out how to stop it is a lot harder. 



_Kradok_ #7 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:23

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Get angry about it and get better.  Then you'll learn you don't have to BE a seal.  You can choose to play smarter.  Sure, your team may get rolled - but you can manage your own enjoyment and stats (if you want).  Use it as motivation to learn and progress.  Seal clubbers have been in the game since the inception.  

 

TL/DR...  Be a tank, don't be a seal.  You choose your path.



tanopasman62 #8 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:26

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Clubbers make finding a match for lower tiers faster, which helps keeping new players into the game as a lesser evil of sorts, it's either facing clubbers after 1-2 minute queue times or having 4+ to get a match (If you get one, when I tried to grind the Italian and Polish lines from tier 1 had my queue timed out several times).



KingRat #9 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:29

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View Post_Kradok_, on Sep 20 2019 - 10:23, said:

Get angry about it and get better.  Then you'll learn you don't have to BE a seal.  You can choose to play smarter.  Sure, your team may get rolled - but you can manage your own enjoyment and stats (if you want).  Use it as motivation to learn and progress.  Seal clubbers have been in the game since the inception.  

 

TL/DR...  Be a tank, don't be a seal.  You choose your path.

 

Image result for wolves or a sheep



crasta #10 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:33

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OP,

There is seal clubbing at every tier. Its a game for the selfish and the desperate. Should be a song. :teethhappy: 

You will often have to face players that are 10 maybe 20 times mores skilled at the game than you.

 

All you can do is find your level of play. You might gravitate to unicum level but you might not.  Just find your level and don't get sucked in to buying tanks and spending too much money. You will either be good or you will get your [edited]kicked but I don't think spending money helps in many cases.

 

Just want to throw that out there cos you only have a few battles.



cartires #11 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:35

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Use that as an incentive to get out of the low tiers....

Flarvin #12 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:36

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View PostKingRat, on Sep 20 2019 - 10:29, said:

 

Image result for wolves or a sheep

 

Loneliness? 

 

Wolves are pack animals. lol 



spud_tuber #13 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:37

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View PostKingRat, on Sep 20 2019 - 09:29, said:

 

Image result for wolves or a sheep

But wolves aren't lonely.  They're very social animals, and rely on the pack for survival.

 

Sure, sometimes there are bachelor males that are between packs, or young pairs just starting out their own pack, but those are the exception rather than the rule.

 

Edit;  ninja'd by Flarvin.   



Flarvin #14 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:38

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View Postspud_tuber, on Sep 20 2019 - 10:37, said:

But wolves aren't lonely.  They're very social animals, and rely on the pack for survival.

 

Sure, sometimes there are bachelor males that are between packs, or young pairs just starting out their own pack, but those are the exception rather than the rule.

 

That is exactly what I was thinking. 

 

Does Hugh Macleod even know anything about wolves? 



Ortinoth_ #15 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:40

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Seal Clubbing is a community term that means a player plays lower tiers then his skill level is, WOT does not place limits on which tier a player can play that is solely upto the player, as its generally looked down upon there is nothing wargaming will do to limit the player choice in playing the tanks he chooses to play or to have fun with

I_QQ_4_U #16 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:41

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There's not much that can be done without hurting the game, it's something that happens in most PvP games. Learn from them. I learned more from watching how good seal clubbers played than anything else.

Garandster #17 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:42

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Just get to tier 5. Tiers 1-4 are a completely different meta then the rest of the game. At tier 5 everything starts to settle in.

 

There is also a difference from a seal clubber and a bad player with a lot of games. At low tier there are a ton of players who get a nose bleed and can't perform higher than tier 4. They have a ton of games, but realistically can only perform averagely in the environment that has advantage on their side. These people are to be pitied, they are bad and can only scrape average with advantage on their side.



Blackstone #18 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:45

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View PostGarandster, on Sep 20 2019 - 10:42, said:

Just get to tier 5. Tiers 1-4 are a completely different meta then the rest of the game. At tier 5 everything starts to settle in.

 

 

^^^THIS^^^



spud_tuber #19 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 16:53

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Part of the issue with seal clubbing is the massive difference in tank performance between the average clubber running multi skill crews, full equipment, and not unusually premium ammo and consumables vs the hodgepodge that new players often have at those tiers.

Better tutorials on the value of good crew and equipment might help some, but cost is an issue for new players as well, especially with the slow gain of credits at the very low tiers while cost of crew training, equipment, and consumables remains the same across all tiers.  Crew XP gain also tends to be a bit slow at those tiers, limiting their ability to train a crew.

There's several reasons I advise people to get out of the baby tiers ASAP and really learn the game at T4-6, and the slow economy of the baby tires is one of those reasons.

Flarvin #20 Posted Sep 20 2019 - 17:04

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View Postspud_tuber, on Sep 20 2019 - 10:53, said:

Part of the issue with seal clubbing is the massive difference in tank performance between the average clubber running multi skill crews, full equipment, and not unusually premium ammo and consumables vs the hodgepodge that new players often have at those tiers.

 

I would say tank performance has far less influence compared to player skill, in seal clubbing.

 

I have ground crews at low tiers, even 75% ones. My game knowledge still allowed me to outperform newer players. 

 

The things you mention become more important when skill is more level. 

 

If I played a golf pro a round of golf, it is not going to be his better golf clubs that will beat me. Heck the pro could play with crap clubs and still beat me. But the quality of the clubs that pro uses, would matter much more, when playing another pro. 






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