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Can someone explain this?

Spotting

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Maniac57c #1 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:29

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Sorry no replays, but I have seen a recurring thing happen when I'm playing arty.

Someone will get spotted by several of my team and be clearly inside the view range of multiple tanks, yet when I aim at it, it vanishes. Only to reappear 5 seconds later when I shift target.

I get that the spotter might move away and lose him, but don't the other greens easily within range keep the red spotted anyway?

It's completely maddening when they poof out of sight right as you get close to firing and I wanna know why.



DeviouslyCursed #2 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:32

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View PostManiac57c, on Oct 04 2019 - 05:29, said:

Sorry no replays, but I have seen a recurring thing happen when I'm playing arty.

Someone will get spotted by several of my team and be clearly inside the view range of multiple tanks, yet when I aim at it, it vanishes. Only to reappear 5 seconds later when I shift target.

I get that the spotter might move away and lose him, but don't the other greens easily within range keep the red spotted anyway?

It's completely maddening when they poof out of sight right as you get close to firing and I wanna know why.


 Turn your G-D replays on. Seriously. This is nothing but noobie mumbo-jumbo, and no one is going to be able to help you at all.



Maniac57c #3 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:35

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View PostDeviouslyCursed, on Oct 04 2019 - 05:32, said:


 Turn your G-D replays on. Seriously. This is nothing but noobie mumbo-jumbo, and no one is going to be able to help you at all.

Thanks for the help. Same old toxic crap doesn't explain anything but the lack of participation here.



Maniac57c #4 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:36

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I'm a noob to PC like I said, and only just learned how to find my replays. My post isn't hard to understand without pictures.

PapioTitan #5 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:36

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"I get that the spotter might move away and lose him, but don't the other greens easily within range keep the red spotted anyway?"

 

Not necessarily. Proxy spotting is a mixed bag. Obstacles and your teammates spotting skills will determine visibility to include if and how long the enemy stays spotted.



DeviouslyCursed #6 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:39

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View PostManiac57c, on Oct 04 2019 - 05:35, said:

Thanks for the help. Same old toxic crap doesn't explain anything but the lack of participation here.

 

View PostManiac57c, on Oct 04 2019 - 05:36, said:

I'm a noob to PC like I said, and only just learned how to find my replays. My post isn't hard to understand without pictures.

 

Actually, the post is impossible to understand. No one is going to be able to explain what it is you think you are seeing, b/c you don't understand it yourself. Therefore your explanation is going to be lacking. It's not a toxic post, it's the truth. You want explanations for what you don't understand, provide a replay so those with knowledge can explain it. The crap you posted provides absolutely nothing for anyone to go on.

 

EDIT: You can cry all you want about the hard facts of reality, but it won't change reality. Don't blame the person that is pointing it out.


Edited by DeviouslyCursed, Oct 04 2019 - 05:41.


death_stryker #7 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:40

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The answer is spotting and camouflage mechanics. Even if an enemy is within view range of a friendly, said friendly may not have a direct line of sight to the enemy, in which case they will not be able to spot them. Even if an enemy is within view range of a friendly who does have direct line of sight, they still may not be able to spot them due to the camouflage values of the enemy (which effectively "cancels out" some of your view range). 

 

Only if a friendly has direct line of sight to the enemy and has enough view range to spot the enemy despite their camouflage values (which also vary wildly between different tanks and between stationary and moving tanks - camo while stationary >> camo while moving) will they actually spot said enemy. 

 

In practice, this combination of mechanics results in quite a complicated mess to comprehend, and so all you can really do to predict if one tank will be able to spot another is by knowing the map really really well.

 

Also, as PapioTitan said, proxy spotting is another mechanic, where tanks within 50 meters of each other automatically spot each other, and continue to spot each other as long as they are within that range.



Maniac57c #8 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:45

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View Postdeath_stryker, on Oct 04 2019 - 05:40, said:

The answer is spotting and camouflage mechanics. Even if an enemy is within view range of a friendly, said friendly may not have a direct line of sight to the enemy, in which case they will not be able to spot them. Even if an enemy is within view range of a friendly who does have direct line of sight, they still may not be able to spot them due to the camouflage values of the enemy (which effectively "cancels out" some of your view range). 

 

Only if a friendly has direct line of sight to the enemy and has enough view range to spot the enemy despite their camouflage values (which also vary wildly between different tanks and between stationary and moving tanks - camo while stationary >> camo while moving) will they actually spot said enemy. 

 

In practice, this combination of mechanics results in quite a complicated mess to comprehend, and so all you can really do to predict if one tank will be able to spot another is by knowing the map really really well.

 

Also, as PapioTitan said, proxy spotting is another mechanic, where tanks within 50 meters of each other automatically spot each other, and continue to spot each other as long as they are within that range.

Okay this makes sense since I don't yet have very good map knowledge and the terrain is a lot different than what I'm used to. Could be blocked sightlines despite looking close enough on worldview.

I should have thought of that myself.

Thank you.



I_QQ_4_U #9 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 05:48

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Most obvious answer without a replay is likely they are getting spotted then going dark and getting spotted again. Just because something is in your view range doesn't mean you will see it.

Ratnikk #10 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 06:12

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An enemy can be in an open field and not be spotted if his camo value is high enough and your allies view range is low. Look at this video it helped me a lot understand the mechanics.

 



choSenfroZen_1 #11 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 06:28

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If the target is on the mini map.

 

It is visible using the strategic view, I believe anywhere on the map, regardless of arty range.

 

They are only visible for 10 seconds. If in range but with some cover. They may pop in and out of being lit up as they shoot or a teammate re-spots.



Insanefriend #12 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 13:57

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View PostManiac57c, on Oct 03 2019 - 22:45, said:

Okay this makes sense since I don't yet have very good map knowledge and the terrain is a lot different than what I'm used to. Could be blocked sightlines despite looking close enough on worldview.

I should have thought of that myself.

Thank you.

 

It's hard to tell sight lines when playing arty from the top down view at times as seeing the height difference and bush cover get's a lot harder.  Once you learn the maps to the point you know where every bush is you can get a much better idea when things are or are not going to get spotted.  Though that takes many many battles, and even then sometimes you get surprised.



Heat_Stroke #13 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 14:53

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It's not you it's the goofy optics in this game. I've never understood how you can see something through a building or hill but can't see someone sitting in bush 10' from you until he fires. Bad game mechanics for how Camo and optics work. Just have to live with it.

Markd73 #14 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 15:17

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View PostHeat_Stroke, on Oct 04 2019 - 13:53, said:

It's not you it's the goofy optics in this game. I've never understood how you can see something through a building or hill but can't see someone sitting in bush 10' from you until he fires. Bad game mechanics for how Camo and optics work. Just have to live with it.

 

I was under the impression that you would proxy spot him at 50M by default? This would be whether they fired or not.


Edited by Markd73, Oct 04 2019 - 15:18.


__Worm__ #15 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 19:28

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View PostDeviouslyCursed, on Oct 03 2019 - 21:32, said:


 Turn your G-D replays on. Seriously. This is nothing but noobie mumbo-jumbo, and no one is going to be able to help you at all.

 

Looking at the informative replies offered it looks to be that you were wrong.

 

Seems me and the others weren't looking to troll like you but, help out.

 

good job being "that" guy ... guy.



bevust #16 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 19:33

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View PostDeviouslyCursed, on Oct 04 2019 - 04:32, said:


 Turn your G-D replays on. Seriously. This is nothing but noobie mumbo-jumbo, and no one is going to be able to help you at all.

WHAT DOES REPLAYS HAVE TO DO WITH SPOTTING



I_QQ_4_U #17 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 19:40

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View Post__Worm__, on Oct 04 2019 - 19:28, said:

 

Looking at the informative replies offered it looks to be that you were wrong.

 

Seems me and the others weren't looking to troll like you but, help out.

 

good job being "that" guy ... guy.

 

 

Any answers are just speculation, nobody can give a more valid answer to his question without a replay.



I_QQ_4_U #18 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 19:41

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View Postbevust, on Oct 04 2019 - 19:33, said:

WHAT DOES REPLAYS HAVE TO DO WITH SPOTTING

 

BECAUSE WITHOUT ONE NOBODY CAN GIVE AN INFORMED ANSWER.



__Worm__ #19 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 23:45

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View PostI_QQ_4_U, on Oct 04 2019 - 11:40, said:

 

 

Any answers are just speculation, nobody can give a more valid answer to his question without a replay.

 

IDK

question seemed pretty self explanatory ...

 

everyone else got it

 

there are times a reply could be helpful though, don't get me wrong, just not in this instance.



I_QQ_4_U #20 Posted Oct 04 2019 - 23:52

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View Post__Worm__, on Oct 04 2019 - 23:45, said:

 

IDK

question seemed pretty self explanatory ...

 

everyone else got it

 

there are times a reply could be helpful though, don't get me wrong, just not in this instance.

 

If you want a guess then yeah, no replay needed, if you want an explanation then a replay is needed.

 

My guess was that the OP has no idea how spotting mechanics work and it was simply a tank getting spotted twice. Without a replay that's all we can do, is guess, which is all he got.







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