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High Explosive (HE) Ammo Rebalance Comparison w/ KV-2


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sahmlockhart #1 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 04:15

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Sandbox server is now LIVE!... Now with the terrible HE shell changes...

 

Try out ammo rebalance on the Sandbox server by clicking "Install Game by ID" from the 'All Games' tab on WG Gamecenter app ...

(i think you might have to sign up for the Sandbox @ https://worldoftanks.com/en/sandbox/)

Use the code: WOT.SB.PRODUCTION@https://wgus-wotru.wargaming.net

 

From the main website: "Last December we announced our intention to decrease the damage done by special rounds by 25–30% while keeping their armor penetration values. As such revisions require rigorous testing, more time was needed to implement them. Now that we have completed this round of changes, we would like to invite you to test it in the Sandbox."



Zanarkand_C #2 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 04:39

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WG out here fixing what aint broken XD

PanzerXO #3 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 04:41

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The RU Players hate HE -- Because Stallinium doesn't matter vs HE

HOTA_CHATON #4 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 04:50

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This is similar to the "Russian Refund".  Remember that?  Yeah, same thing almost.

HOTA_CHATON #5 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 04:51

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View PostPanzerXO, on Oct 18 2019 - 21:41, said:

The RU Players hate HE -- Because Stallinium doesn't matter vs HE


Yes, everything must go their way or they cry like babies.



Avalon304 #6 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 05:24

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Oh no... your derp gun wont be able to one shot things. The horror.

the_dude_76 #7 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 05:42

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View PostAvalon304, on Oct 18 2019 - 22:24, said:

Oh no... your derp gun wont be able to one shot things. The horror.

 

We get it, you don't like the derp tanks, you can go ahead and take your broken record off of the player...

 

What you don't seem to get is that you're not the only one who plays this game and that your opinion means as much to anyone here as their opinions mean to you...



JEDIDIEUGH #8 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 07:25

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View Postthe_dude_76, on Oct 18 2019 - 20:42, said:

 

We get it, you don't like the derp tanks, you can go ahead and take your broken record off of the player...

 

What you don't seem to get is that you're not the only one who plays this game and that your opinion means as much to anyone here as their opinions mean to you...

I also don't like Derp guns. A bit hypocritical trying to badger someone for posting their opinion. Your opinion is not more important than theirs.

 

 

And regarding the HE nerfs that sahm put on display in this match on the sandbox server, sahm was able to do repeated damage to the KV-1's turret instead of doing 0 damage with AP and then he showed us how to use AP properly in the KV-2. Shooting HE at the T-150 wasn't a good idea because he could easily pen the T-150 with either AP round. I think if the changes go through to the live server, this is roughly what you should expect. Being able to know when to shoot AP instead of HE will be a valuable asset instead of the AP rounds being otherwise untouched. I'm excited to see if it will go through; if it doesn't so be it.


Edited by JEDIDIEUGH, Oct 19 2019 - 07:26.


JakeTheMystic #9 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 07:43

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Yup, finally time to uninstall for good. I said if they ever ruined the KV-2, I would leave and they have gone and done just that. 

 

I'm extremely disappointed with WG. People have spoken mostly against the premium changes as they were on both the EU and RU forums, so now they gave it the green light to change HE as well? Shoot, what's the point in learning the game if they are just going to change things up every few years... 



IndygoEEI #10 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 08:26

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View Postsahmlockhart, on Oct 18 2019 - 22:15, said:

 

Sandbox server is now LIVE!... Now with the terrible HE shell changes...

 

Try out ammo rebalance on the Sandbox server by clicking "Install Game by ID" from the 'All Games' tab on WG Gamecenter app ...

(i think you might have to sign up for the Sandbox @ https://worldoftanks.com/en/sandbox/)

Use the code: WOT.SB.PRODUCTION@https://wgus-wotru.wargaming.net

 

From the main website: "Last December we announced our intention to decrease the damage done by special rounds by 25–30% while keeping their armor penetration values. As such revisions require rigorous testing, more time was needed to implement them. Now that we have completed this round of changes, we would like to invite you to test it in the Sandbox."

 

Hey Sahm, I see you don't have the Premium KV2R.  Would you like one when it goes on

sale next time?



HeraldricKnight #11 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 09:41

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Wargaming is probably going to give turreted howitzers AP shells with more alpha than the old HE shells...

Thambry #12 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 10:35

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I see nothing wrong with HE - so need to change it. Instead they should do nerf the wheelies.

Avalon304 #13 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 11:39

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View Postthe_dude_76, on Oct 18 2019 - 21:42, said:

 

We get it, you don't like the derp tanks, you can go ahead and take your broken record off of the player...

 

What you don't seem to get is that you're not the only one who plays this game and that your opinion means as much to anyone here as their opinions mean to you...

 

Oh no... Im very aware others play this game. But unlike them Im also cognizant of when things I enjoy are toxic for the game. I too have enjoyed ruining many a players game with my M4 Derpman or KV-2, or Panzer IV H or Sherman III. But Im fully aware that while I was laughing my butt off as I one shot them they werent having a fun time. My 0-skill gameplay was making their game unfun. (And please do not try to imply that derp guns require any sort of skill because they absolutely do not. I have a 58% winrate in my KV-2 and a 66% win rate in my M4 Sherman... and I just drive forward and shoot at things. Derp guns are low risk, high reward for the most part and low risk high reward game play is not something that should exist).

 

So while I enjoyed derps, I wont shed a single tear if or when they get nerfed into the ground. Seeing HE return to a utility round, meaning for chip damage against emplaced tanks, resetting caps and tracking enemy tanks more reliably (which is what HE was in the old days) is a welcome and much needed change. I'll find other ways to have "fun", likely with far less negative impact on other players games.

 

 

EDIT: And its likely none of our opinions matter in this, since it seems as if the RU server likes HE spam just as much as I do.

 

View PostThambry, on Oct 19 2019 - 02:35, said:

I see nothing wrong with HE - so need to change it. Instead they should do nerf the wheelies.

 

Im just going to point out that this HE nerf does effectively nerf the wheeled vehicles performance against other light tanks as their high pen HE was a massive advantage over most other tracked light tanks. (And this HE nerf doesnt actually make them more powerful either (as Im seen implied), because HE was never really a good round to shoot at a wheeled vehicle in the first place because 9 times out of 10 the wheel would just eat it anyway).

 

View PostJakeTheMystic, on Oct 18 2019 - 23:43, said:

Shoot, what's the point in learning the game if they are just going to change things up every few years... 

 

This game, for the most part, atleast in terms of basic skills youve needed to learn hasnt changed in 9 bloody years... so... I mean... thats not "every few years"... and theres no indication that they intend to make changes this sweeping every few years... so... thats a silly bit of hyperbole to reach for....


Edited by Avalon304, Oct 19 2019 - 11:52.


Troa_Barton #14 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 12:01

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I have seen some terrible reworks / balance passes in my days but this, this sits above them all as the single dumbest idea ever.
You want to tweak it to fill those roles? Add a minimum damage roll to the modifier and done.

You don't want to get one shot, press tab at the beginning of the game and don't scout with your face.



Waarheid #15 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 15:33

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View PostJEDIDIEUGH, on Oct 19 2019 - 01:25, said:

I also don't like Derp guns. A bit hypocritical trying to badger someone for posting their opinion. Your opinion is not more important than theirs.

 

 

And regarding the HE nerfs that sahm put on display in this match on the sandbox server, sahm was able to do repeated damage to the KV-1's turret instead of doing 0 damage with AP and then he showed us how to use AP properly in the KV-2. Shooting HE at the T-150 wasn't a good idea because he could easily pen the T-150 with either AP round. I think if the changes go through to the live server, this is roughly what you should expect. Being able to know when to shoot AP instead of HE will be a valuable asset instead of the AP rounds being otherwise untouched. I'm excited to see if it will go through; if it doesn't so be it.


And what about those guns that do not have an AP shell? Guess what, more premimum ammo will be shot through those guns than anything else. 


Edited by Waarheid, Oct 19 2019 - 15:33.


_Tsavo_ #16 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 15:38

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View PostPanzerXO, on Oct 18 2019 - 22:41, said:

The RU Players hate HE -- Because Stallinium doesn't matter vs HE

And this is why this sandbox test will likely see live.  What RU wants, RU gets.  The rest?  "Who?" said SerB as he counted his coin. 

 

I think the changes are not warranted and without a funwagon T49, I'll be left wanting something that there's zero placebo for. 

 

And no, I'm not gonna 90 my T49.


Edited by _Tsavo_, Oct 19 2019 - 15:40.


the_dude_76 #17 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 15:55

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View PostJEDIDIEUGH, on Oct 19 2019 - 00:25, said:

I also don't like Derp guns. A bit hypocritical trying to badger someone for posting their opinion. Your opinion is not more important than theirs.

 

 

Opinion??? Where did they offer an opinion?? All they did was mock someone for sharing theirs. Maybe you should stop being a hypocrite yourself and chastise them...

 

Block Quote

  I think if the changes go through to the live server, this is roughly what you should expect. 

 

So you haven't actually played on the sandbox server yet then. Because so far the majority seem to have decided that gold spam will be the way to go in any derp tanks...

 



the_dude_76 #18 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 15:59

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View PostAvalon304, on Oct 19 2019 - 04:39, said:

 

Oh no... Im very aware others play this game. But unlike them Im also cognizant of when things I enjoy are toxic for the game. 

 

Ok, I see now. It's the definition of the word "opinion" that utterly and completely eludes you and makes you seem like you're full of yourself...

 



Rides_with_Death #19 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 16:26

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View Postthe_dude_76, on Oct 19 2019 - 08:55, said:

 

Opinion??? Where did they offer an opinion?? All they did was mock someone for sharing theirs. Maybe you should stop being a hypocrite yourself and chastise them...

 

 

So you haven't actually played on the sandbox server yet then. Because so far the majority seem to have decided that gold spam will be the way to go in any derp tanks...

 

I don't think that would be the new meta. The prem and regular shells have already been reworked in past sand box tests. even if they didn't touch HE it would still be nerfed do to everything else getting buffed. But till I play it and see it for my self I don't have an the experience with the changes to say one way or the other.. 



JEDIDIEUGH #20 Posted Oct 19 2019 - 18:05

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View PostWaarheid, on Oct 19 2019 - 06:33, said:


And what about those guns that do not have an AP shell? Guess what, more premimum ammo will be shot through those guns than anything else. 

If you're referring to tanks like the Type 5/ FV that have a premium HESH shell, WG hasn't shown us what their plans are for those shell types. Hard to make assumptions about those. If you're referring to low tier derp guns with HEAT as their second shell, the HEAT has less than 110 mm of pen and is going to be largely ineffective against higher tiers unless you flank them (you can't just frontally pen someone for 1/3 of their hp). Again, nerfing HE makes it so that you HAVE to use your other ammunition types in order to stay competitive. 

View Postthe_dude_76, on Oct 19 2019 - 06:55, said:

 

Opinion??? Where did they offer an opinion?? All they did was mock someone for sharing theirs. Maybe you should stop being a hypocrite yourself and chastise them...

 

 

So you haven't actually played on the sandbox server yet then. Because so far the majority seem to have decided that gold spam will be the way to go in any derp tanks...

 

Have you played the sandbox? I don't think it really matters when there is plenty of gameplay (which I have watched) that shows all I need to know about how the HE mechanic works. I have based my opinion on the changes on a couple hours of footage from the sandbox server. I also don't get how people think that this will just lead to gold spam. It seems to me that WoT players struggle to understand that there are more than 1 ammo type and so they play with only one type of ammunition. Because of that, most players fail to become better at the game as they reinforce their bad habits. If the HE changes happen, it will cause a mass of people to have to adjust and get out of their comfort zone; they don't like it. These changes only hinder a small group of tanks which encourage a style of gameplay that is toxic for the game and its players. 

With that being said, I understand how fun it is to derp something for all their HP because I play with the Foch 155 solely with HE in pub matches. Those 1100 rolls on the batchats and such will be missed, but I'm perfectly fine playing in a game without the crazy alpha damage potential that these tanks have. 

 


Edited by JEDIDIEUGH, Oct 19 2019 - 18:43.





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