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game play match making unfair matching uneven play unconcerned admin

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Krye #1 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 20:32

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ive been playing this game nearly since the beginning. much graphical upgrades have really improved. the buy and sell items have also flooded the game. however what has really caused my decline and reluctance to spend money or have interest in the game is due to the fact that the match making has never been really fixed or addressed. if so very little or just enough to please certain issues only. NEVER has it ever fixed the uneven or tank for tank match making... almost to the point that it seems that wargaming has lost the focus of the ww1 and ww2 aspect in detail. the game is really popular yes by all means yes. but if one would look closely at the inner focus of random battles ... not clan wars or team battles ect. but random gameplay and missions--- the Match making is un addressed to the point of worthless time spent. i have recently placed my focus elsewhere to only peek back at what i  use too enjoy in WOT only to find it has grown worst. out of control almost. now i know WG monitors the game. however the level of clever cheating still exist. reporting seems to by many that ive corresponded with by email and text.... say the reports they have submitted regarding cheating hardly ever are answered. in fact the uneven match making continues to go unaddressed. ive on a least two conversations have had players admit in PM that they used illegal mads at one time or another. to see WG all but address the real fair game play issues leaves me to believe that if you have money to play you are good. OR if your IQ is higher than a ear of corn you are set to play... WG you simply need to address the basics of the fundamentals. set a solid standard. get rid of all cheaters completely. fix what is broken- MM for one. step up the penalties for rule violations ans spammers. place a good level base within tier mm gameplay... 

CV_Rework_is_Fine #2 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 20:47

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View PostKrye, on Nov 27 2019 - 19:32, said:

ive been playing this game nearly since the beginning. much graphical upgrades have really improved. the buy and sell items have also flooded the game. however what has really caused my decline and reluctance to spend money or have interest in the game is due to the fact that the match making has never been really fixed or addressed. if so very little or just enough to please certain issues only. NEVER has it ever fixed the uneven or tank for tank match making... almost to the point that it seems that wargaming has lost the focus of the ww1 and ww2 aspect in detail. the game is really popular yes by all means yes. but if one would look closely at the inner focus of random battles ... not clan wars or team battles ect. but random gameplay and missions--- the Match making is un addressed to the point of worthless time spent. i have recently placed my focus elsewhere to only peek back at what i  use too enjoy in WOT only to find it has grown worst. out of control almost. now i know WG monitors the game. however the level of clever cheating still exist. reporting seems to by many that ive corresponded with by email and text.... say the reports they have submitted regarding cheating hardly ever are answered. in fact the uneven match making continues to go unaddressed. ive on a least two conversations have had players admit in PM that they used illegal mads at one time or another. to see WG all but address the real fair game play issues leaves me to believe that if you have money to play you are good. OR if your IQ is higher than a ear of corn you are set to play... WG you simply need to address the basics of the fundamentals. set a solid standard. get rid of all cheaters completely. fix what is broken- MM for one. step up the penalties for rule violations ans spammers. place a good level base within tier mm gameplay... 

 

1 : The MM is just an excuse for a lot of players, sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's the truth, why came some players hit 65% win ratios or more with the exact same MM as you have, I'll tell you why, they are just better at the game. 

2 : WoT has never been just about WW1 and WW2 tanks, they have also said its a ' Arcade tank game based on historical tanks ' Not WW2 etc, not a sim and so on. 

3 : Cheating does exist I don't think anyone will deny that, however in my opinion is not even close to the levels some people claim. That goes back to point 1. Some peoples ego's cannot take that some players are just better, so they accuse them of cheating. 

4 : Every cheating report with a replay will be responded to ( most people just spam reports because they got outplayed, or don't understand how something happened so they scream cheats ), the fact they don't reply with what happened is purely down to data protection laws and is the same worldwide. 

5 : I'm sure some players have replied to you in PM's admitting they cheat, hell I've replied to PM's before saying ' Yea I use RELHAX ', that doesn't mean I'm using cheats, it means I'm trolling people's egos and stupidity. 

6 : Spotting cheating in a game like WoT isn't always easy, and the fact that im 100% sure they get spammed daily with hundreds if not thousands of reports of cheating ( by people that dont understand the game ) does not help the matter. 

7 : No game out there is free of cheats in one form or another, and asking for a completely cheat free game is totally impossible. 

8 : See point 1. 

 

Now I'm not saying the game is perfect it's FAR from it, but it is considerably better than it was. 


Edited by Tolos, Nov 27 2019 - 20:54.


low_bidder #3 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:00

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Tolos,

 

I totally disagree with your #1 point.  The number of posts on this forum about MM being poorly designed is overwhelming. And I mean overwhelming.  Whether you tie unbalanced teams or preferential teams to MM is yet another observation by many that manifests the results to poor MM design.

Cheating and outcome manipulation go hand-in-hand. I have never seen anything posted about specific players caught doing so. Even identifying the cheats does nothing.



Bootknife #4 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:06

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In my opinion, MM and RNG are WG's worst PR issues.  And since perception is reality, they have a major issue, real or not.

 

I tend to be in the middle. They're both an issue, but not as bad as some would claim.



Devil__Anse #5 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:06

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the MM on this server is a complete joke.  there is NO WAY with 200ish people in queue the team stacking that is going on is happening "randomly"  literally the last match I played in there was a combined wn8 difference of 8000...EIGHT THOUSAND.  how the [edited]any developer can expect any kind of decent gameplay with a MM that routinely creates matches like this is beyond me.  open server transfers...the NA cluster is dead AF

ThaneTyrian #6 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:14

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My 2 cents:  I think the VAST MAJORITY of players do not ever post anything in the forum, so the OVERWHELMING number of posts about matchmaking is a large percentage of a very small number.  I think matchmaking is therefore OK to the vast majority of players (the silent majority).  Since the last FIX, I've experienced very few Tier X battles in the Tier VIII Premiums I play (unless ON TRACK).  The great majority of the battles I'm in now are all Tier VIIIs.  To me, THAT'S a HUGE improvement over what the system WAS (3-5-7).  The only thing I think WG could do to better the current MM is to somehow add in "Player Skill" to the balancing, BUT how to quantify THAT?  Win%? Avg Damage caused per battle? And how many people have inflated stats because they're good players and drop down to the lower tiers to pad their stats?  So would putting "player skill" into the MM REALLY make a true difference?  Probably not, I think.  Not to mention the probable far longer wait times in Que waiting to get into a perfectly matched battle - it could be EXCESSIVE.  In Random Battles, one must simply ACCEPT the RANDOMNESS of the team set ups.  If one does not want the Randomness, perhaps join a Clan where one can control the makeup of the team one is on in both vehicle mix, player skill, and what map one plays on.  Just my 2 cents.

 

Cheers!


Edited by ThaneTyrian, Nov 27 2019 - 21:16.


Bolted_On #7 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:33

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View Postlow_bidder, on Nov 27 2019 - 20:00, said:

Tolos,

 

I totally disagree with your #1 point.  The number of posts on this forum about MM being poorly designed is overwhelming. And I mean overwhelming.  Whether you tie unbalanced teams or preferential teams to MM is yet another observation by many that manifests the results to poor MM design.

Cheating and outcome manipulation go hand-in-hand. I have never seen anything posted about specific players caught doing so. Even identifying the cheats does nothing.

 

You absolutely hit the nail on the head.

 

If you go back through the forum post history, you will see that EVERY time someone makes a post like this, it is ALWAYS one of the "elitist unicums" (ha) who respond to try and discredit OP.    Every single time.   Why is that ??  We all know the answer to that, and quite frankly, I rarely even play this game anymore for that and a multitude of other reasons.  So there it is, either accept that WG supports this and MM will never be fixed and continue to play and be frustrated to no end, or simply walk away as I have.   It's that simple.     



GeorgePreddy #8 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:39

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Dear OP;

 

1)  "Tank for tank" matching is very difficult to achieve without having a huge queue for MM to work with... class for class matching has been improved and is now working well, if not perfectly.

 

2)  What you call "the level of clever cheating" is quite low in WoT due to all the most important aspects and mechanics of the game being server-side in WoT. The marginal advantages given by client side cheat mods are not nearly as powerful or rampant as players like you suggest, and, as a practical matter, some level of cheating is present in every online game and it is impossible to totally and completely stamp it out.

 

3)  The fact that many players have had marginal or worse success in the game does not make it a bad game, like all PvP games, it is difficult to exceed average personal statistics.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



Markd73 #9 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:53

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View Postlow_bidder, on Nov 27 2019 - 20:00, said:

Tolos,

 

I totally disagree with your #1 point.  The number of posts on this forum about MM being poorly designed is overwhelming. And I mean overwhelming.  

Appeal to the masses fallacy. 

 

Whether you tie unbalanced teams or preferential teams to MM is yet another observation by many that manifests the results to poor MM design.

Over a large enough sample size, we all get the same balance within MM. i.e. good teams, great teams, bad teams, etc. The only difference is the individual performance of the player.

 

Cheating and outcome manipulation go hand-in-hand. I have never seen anything posted about specific players caught doing so. 

Anecdotal evidence. Just because you have not seen anything posted does not prove or disprove the level of "cheating and outcome manipulation".

 

Even identifying the cheats does nothing.

How do you know that to be true or untrue? What non-anecdotal evidence do you have to support this conclusion?

 

 



Markd73 #10 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:55

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View PostBolted_On, on Nov 27 2019 - 20:33, said:

 

You absolutely hit the nail on the head.

 

If you go back through the forum post history, you will see that EVERY time someone makes a post like this, it is ALWAYS one of the "elitist unicums" (ha) who respond to try and discredit OP.    Every single time. 

Nope. I am in no way an "elitist unicum" and I do not agree with his conclusions. He has constructed a fallacious argument without supporting evidence.

 

  Why is that ??  We all know the answer to that, and quite frankly, I rarely even play this game anymore for that and a multitude of other reasons.  So there it is, either accept that WG supports this and MM will never be fixed and continue to play and be frustrated to no end, or simply walk away as I have.   It's that simple.     

 



CV_Rework_is_Fine #11 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:55

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View Postlow_bidder, on Nov 27 2019 - 20:00, said:

Tolos,

 

I totally disagree with your #1 point.  The number of posts on this forum about MM being poorly designed is overwhelming. And I mean overwhelming.  Whether you tie unbalanced teams or preferential teams to MM is yet another observation by many that manifests the results to poor MM design.

Cheating and outcome manipulation go hand-in-hand. I have never seen anything posted about specific players caught doing so. Even identifying the cheats does nothing.

Oh course you disagree with point 1, and I understand why. But the fact is this, we all have the same MM, yet some people get 45% and some people get 65%, that doesnt mean the 65%er is lucky, it means he's better, plain and simple.

 

As for people posting about it, people also post overwhelmingly about the earth being flat. Number of posts does not equate to fact. You couldn't possibly know that identifying a cheat does nothing, as WG will not release any info on a sanction. 



CV_Rework_is_Fine #12 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 21:58

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View PostBolted_On, on Nov 27 2019 - 20:33, said:

 

You absolutely hit the nail on the head.

 

If you go back through the forum post history, you will see that EVERY time someone makes a post like this, it is ALWAYS one of the "elitist unicums" (ha) who respond to try and discredit OP.    Every single time.   Why is that ??  We all know the answer to that, and quite frankly, I rarely even play this game anymore for that and a multitude of other reasons.  So there it is, either accept that WG supports this and MM will never be fixed and continue to play and be frustrated to no end, or simply walk away as I have.   It's that simple.     

 

At no point have I tried to discredit the OP., I simply pointed out that perception is not reality. As for the ' we all know the answer to that ' comment, PLEASE tell me that you are implying that I cheat, because that really would make my day :)


Edited by Tolos, Nov 27 2019 - 22:42.


Da_Craw #13 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 22:51

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I'm fine with the MM.  In the four years I've been playing it has changed from actually random to matching by class and to a lesser extent, role.  3-5-7 was a lesson in unintended consequences, but that has been mostly alleviated.  When I started, the constant complaints were "they got all the heavies" or "I was the only 8 in a battle with 12 tier 10s!"  The SBMM argument is an entire server worth of ranting over a simple misunderstanding; the difference between a level playing field for a team versus a level playing field for an individual player.  The current system is level for the individual.  The requested SBMM would make it level for the team at the expense of equality for individual players.  

dunniteowl #14 Posted Nov 27 2019 - 23:05

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View Postlow_bidder, on Nov 27 2019 - 14:00, said:

Tolos,

 

I totally disagree with your #1 point.  The number of posts on this forum about MM being poorly designed is overwhelming. And I mean overwhelming.  Whether you tie unbalanced teams or preferential teams to MM is yet another observation by many that manifests the results to poor MM design.

Cheating and outcome manipulation go hand-in-hand. I have never seen anything posted about specific players caught doing so. Even identifying the cheats does nothing.

 

As Mark Twain said, "Just because a notion is popular doesn't mean it's right."

 

There are an overwhelming number of whine posts about MM.  I say Whine Posts, because that's pretty much what 98% of them amount to being.  As with Spotting and Vision mechanics, there are an overwhelming -- And I mean overwhelming -- number of them that are based on sour grapes from losing more than some players like.

 

This is right in line with an overwhelming -- and I mean overwhelming -- number of anti-arty posts that have, at their source, dissatisfaction with a mechanic of the game that those people simply do not like.  Gold Rounds, Platoons, Seal Clubbers, Cheaters, Griefers, MM, you name it, they all have at their core a dislike of the way the game 'treats' them or the way players are not living up to their expectations of dominance.

 

There is one thing that the overwhelming -- and I mean overwhelming -- number of these complaints have:  They are ENTIRELY EXTERNALIZED complaints.

 

The vast majority of these folks are complaining about stuff that ALL of us deal with in some manner, some better than most and ALL of that stuff is externalized, outside of control, constants within the gaming environment.  How is it that some folks seem to be able to overcome all that and succeed at the game where so many others are busy yelling their overwhelming complaints to the heavens and the WG Gods, demanding changes be made -- or else?

 

You can only do you in this game.  Most folks, when 'doing themselves' doesn't live up to expectations want to find something to blame, focus their attention upon and say, THAT!  That's the reason for me not being so great at this game!  If it weren't for that, these games would be [insert rationalized reason du-jour here] for everyone.

 

So, like I said Mark Twain said, "Just because a notion is popular doesn't mean it's right."

 

 

Good Luck with the next game OP.  Hope you find something that is more fun for you.

 

 

GL, HF & DLTDHYIA!

OvO


Edited by dunniteowl, Nov 28 2019 - 15:07.


Bootknife #15 Posted Nov 28 2019 - 01:12

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View PostTolos, on Nov 27 2019 - 15:58, said:

 

At no point have I tried to discredit the OP., I simply pointed out that perception is not reality. As for the ' we all know the answer to that ' comment, PLEASE tell me that you are implying that I cheat, because that really would make my day :)

 

Bad news - Perception is reality.  Your's is your's and his is his.  So the best you have here is a draw.  Until one of you squats and grunts evidence and not opinion.  Fact...



CV_Rework_is_Fine #16 Posted Nov 28 2019 - 01:17

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View PostBootknife, on Nov 28 2019 - 00:12, said:

 

Bad news - Perception is reality.  Your's is your's and his is his.  So the best you have here is a draw.  Until one of you squats and grunts evidence and not opinion.  Fact...

My evidence is there for all to see. We both get the same MM yet our stats are vastly different.



low_bidder #17 Posted Nov 28 2019 - 05:37

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There are way too "blame casters" on this forum. That is, those that blame the OP and not the game metrics. Blame casting the OP is a very common cancer.

Da_Craw #18 Posted Nov 28 2019 - 06:41

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View Postlow_bidder, on Nov 27 2019 - 22:37, said:

There are way too "blame casters" on this forum. That is, those that blame the OP and not the game metrics. Blame casting the OP is a very common cancer.

Unfortunately, there is a majority of whine posts, as Dunniteowl notes, that are nothing but an attempt to lay blame for one's own failings.  I succeed despite all of the perceived shortcomings of the game.  Many succeed far more.  There are several threads where good players have accepted the challenge of taking a totally ftp account and guess what?  They have virtually the same stats as their main accounts.  Skill is skill is skill.  It isn't mods, it isn't cheats, it isn't a $10,000 gaming rig (whatever the hell that consists of) and it isn't pay to win mechanics.  It is skill.  Every single time I make a concerted effort to improve a part of my game, something weird happens.  I. GET. BETTER.



dunniteowl #19 Posted Nov 28 2019 - 15:20

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And for clarification's sake, I EMPATHIZE with the OP and many others that make posts such as this one.  I was once in the same camp.

 

Here's what I know to be true:  The more you complain, whine, feel helpless to change your situation or feel that nothing you do is going to make a difference

 

THE MORE THAT BECOMES TRUE FOR YOU. 

 

Perception is NOT reality, however your perception makes a HUGE DIFFERENCE in how you see the world and program yourself thereby.  It's like that Native American Parable of the two wolves in our hearts.

 

It goes a bit like this:

 

A child has a dream of two wolves; one black and one white.

They are constantly at each other, fighting as if to the death.

Neither wolf seems to have an advantage over the other.

 

The child goes to his grandfather and asks him about the dream.

 

The grandfather explains to the child that the dream represents the good and evil in one's own heart.

The two wolves represent good and evil natures and the fighting they are doing is for control of your heart and nature.

 

The child asks, "Which wolf will win?:

The grandfather replies, "Whichever one you feed."

 

This parable is adaptable to how we view the world around us.  You can choose to see the good, the right and the fun in this game and you can feed the wolf in your heart that allows you to take control of your actions, your fate and your fun.  You could, alternatively, choose to see the bad, the awful, the insurmountable hill you have to climb, toss your hands in the air and give up, because you are not strong enough.

 

You control YOU.  Feed the wolf you'd like to see win in your heart.

 

Oh, and from a person who is both Native American and Colonial Intruder by blood and birth, though 100% American; Happy Thanksgiving!

 

GL, HF & HSYBF!
OvO


Edited by dunniteowl, Nov 28 2019 - 15:21.


KLP456 #20 Posted Dec 01 2019 - 00:16

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Dear ToLo's, when the game first came out they said come play WWII battles with WWII tanks...So...u saying what u said is half thruth's...Have a Nice Day......




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