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Systemrename190 #1 Posted Mar 30 2020 - 01:22

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     So I have made three posts so far on Wheeled Vehicles. I'm going to be honest, the first one was a little bias in the favor of WarGaming and the developers. The second post was just a reaction to the amount of toxicity that was in the replies I got. So it's time to revisit this topic, this time in an unbiased way! The Wheeled Vehicles occupy all of the top spots for the fastest tank in the game (that is kind of obvious), they are closely followed by the Pz. I C that can reach 79 km/h, but its terrain resistance will always leave it in the dust. The EBR 105 has a theoretical top speed of 95 km/h, which is 20% more than the Pz. I C's theoretical top speed, The EBR 90's theoretical top speed is 85 km/h, which is 7% more than the Pz. I C's, and the Lynx is not that much faster.

 

     Those are some really fast tanks, but that brings the question of how fast is fast? How fast does it have to go before it feels fast? 60 km/h is when things start to feel fast. 95 km/h is a 58% improvement over 60 km/h. According to tanks.gg, speeds of well over 60 km/h are reached by a ton of different tanks, justifying WarGaming's decision. However, there is a good reason people did not look at tanks.gg first before they started complaining! Terrain resistance is like invisible engine power. It's like the dark matter of engine power. It can improve your engine power or completely decimate it! Did you know an AMX 50 (B) can reach 65 km/h? Many people knew that. But have you ever seen it go 65 km/h!? No, of course not, the terrain resistance rarely lets it reach those speeds in any practical situation. You're never going to need to dash far enough to get up to those speeds in a random battle. If you tried you would likely get shot dead first or your tracks shot off.

 

     Terrain resistance is preventing a lot of high-speed vehicles from reaching high speeds. However, Wheeled Vehicles have terrain remarkable terrain resistance that lets it reach game-breaking speeds quite easily! The wheels cannot be penetrated by most HEAT shells, which is a good thing since it's an answer to people spamming gold all the time, but still, WarGaming has little excuse for this. Are Wheeled Vehicles a bad thing? No! WarGaming has just done it wrong that's all.

 

     If WarGaming had given us the SdKfz 231 or the Staghound, or the Daimler, BA-10, or even the AMD 178 B or any armored car really if they just nerf the speed would have been fine. But instead, they gave us a completely un-nerfed racecar that simply can't fit into a game where the shells are as slow as they are, and don't do enough damage to pop them in one shot. Imagine if these game-breaking vehicles all died in one shot, that would balance them I think! Historically few vehicles were not destroyed by a single penetrating shot, so why do armored cars have such great survivability? Why do armored cars carry such a powerful gun? The Puma, which was one of the biggest and most powerful armored cars within the Wehrmacht, and it only carries a 50mm gun! So why the hell is a freaking AMD at tier VI already carrying a 75mm!? That makes no sense!

 

     So I have given WarGaming the necessary solutions, I believe, since they should be focused on the health of the game rather than historical realism. If we wanted historical realism rather than a healthy game with a nice community we would play War Thunder! Anyways I want to congratulate the World of Tanks team for keeping this nice community up for over ten years, but I think it would be a good idea for the developers to re-evaluate their priorities.



_Katyusha___ #2 Posted Mar 30 2020 - 02:07

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Pumma would be tier IV, AMD is tier VI. Simple. Pumma is highly overvalued. Also that dumb turret that WG puts on Luchs (and should not) and Leopard (that never existed) was only used by few Pummas, most of them did not have turret or even dropped it. 

 

Wheels are broken on too many ways WG must nerf as hihg priority, including the premium one.



thehelmsman #3 Posted Mar 30 2020 - 04:28

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The clown cars are broken for two main reasons:

1.) Their tires eat an ABSURD number of 0-damage critical hits that also don't stop them or even noticeably slow them down. This is a huge advantage over tracked vehicles, especially traditional lights, and it's very unfair in my opinion, considering the cars are the fastest, nimblest, and hardest-to-hit targets in the game in the first place.

2.) Their gun handling is utter bulls#!+. They should not be hitting shots reliably at max speed or flying through the freaking air, other than at point-blank range. Since they are very easily able to get into (and out of) such ranges, that's not an unreasonable handicap, I think.

--Helms

Burhead06 #4 Posted Mar 30 2020 - 04:55

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theres a handful of things they can and honestly should do to ebrs and none of them affect their max speeds

 

(not in any specific order)

1- (and this is more quality of life for pubbies vs ebrs) lower he pen , currently most players use it as a high alpha ap shell vs other lights 

2- (and probably most important as its an actual bug fix and not as much a nerf/balance) fix the wheel from acting like 400mm spaced armor that can eat ap and apcr shells for breakfast. 

3-an indirect nerf to their mobility would be doing something with the wheels , which wg seems to already have in mind of doing something about them. two best ideas ive seen were either A-make breaking even a single wheel impact their turning and hp/t alot more , i was thinking anywhere from 25-40% from the first wheel scaling up

4- nerf camo so that they are more forced into a active role and cant passive scout.

5- and lastly something they are already doing in ranked battled i believe, is effectively change the designation from light to armored car, which would make the match maker put even mounts of ebr's on both teams , so its no longer 1 team is with 3 ebrs and 1 team has 3 normal lights.



15pounder #5 Posted Mar 30 2020 - 20:04

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The current auto aim and the way wheeled vehicles play is totally unrealistic, actually, farcical might be a better word !.

 

But on the other hand the aiming, and accuracy,of artillery in the game is also unrealistic .



Burhead06 #6 Posted Mar 31 2020 - 17:06

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the aiming of all tanks in this game is unrealistic , game automatically compensates your shots for shell drop , you get a nice big clean sightline instead of [edited]optics that would be in the tanks of that time. said this time and time again if your complaint for any tank in this game is its not realistic , go to a different game. if this game was realistic you wouldn't enjoy it you just refuse to admit it.

Pink_Unicorn_Alpha #7 Posted Apr 02 2020 - 22:08

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just think if they made them like the RL ones... u guys would complain more

Edited by Pink_Unicorn_Alpha, Apr 02 2020 - 22:09.


Systemrename190 #8 Posted Apr 03 2020 - 23:41

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View PostBurhead06, on Mar 31 2020 - 09:06, said:

the aiming of all tanks in this game is unrealistic , game automatically compensates your shots for shell drop , you get a nice big clean sightline instead of [edited]optics that would be in the tanks of that time. said this time and time again if your complaint for any tank in this game is its not realistic , go to a different game. if this game was realistic you wouldn't enjoy it you just refuse to admit it.

That complaint about shell drop compensation is something only War Thunder players bring up. lmbodo people still play that?



Burhead06 #9 Posted Apr 05 2020 - 00:02

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View PostSystemrename190, on Apr 03 2020 - 22:41, said:

That complaint about shell drop compensation is something only War Thunder players bring up. lmbodo people still play that?

somebody brought up unrealistic aiming , i pointed out the entire game is unrealistic as far as aiming goes.



mustangbubba44 #10 Posted Apr 07 2020 - 00:33

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I've totally lost it over this.....the game has come down to who has the better ebr players....it's that simple. I'm losing my enthusiasm for the game with these.

3161chromie #11 Posted Apr 14 2020 - 03:38

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MUSTANGBUBBA I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOUR POST. I HAVEN'T SPENT A DIME SINCE THE CARS CAME OUT AND INTEND NOT TO TILL THEY ARE FIXED!

 



TheJeep1 #12 Posted Apr 16 2020 - 17:11

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I can't say how to fix them, all the ideas here sound ok.  But I can tell you Ive seen many many games won solely because one team had a good EBR driver and the other team didn't.

Burhead06 #13 Posted Apr 16 2020 - 20:23

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to be fair , a great many games are won purely because one team has a good player in a good tank , and the other team doesnt. kinda how the game works sometimes. one player carries a team because they know what they doing. doesnt happen often because you cant 1v15. but if two teams are semi close , but the 15th players on both teams are both really good on one team and really bad on the other. can easily be the diff. cause you know , having somebody who does 6k damage on your team when it matters and before the game is over , is usually more important than having a idiot suicide.

Montieth #14 Posted Apr 17 2020 - 23:01

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I would love to see more wheeled armor. And a chance for getting stuck would be reasonable. I've had to dig my Ferret out of a 2' deep mud hole by myself in the back yard. I'm most aware of the limits that they have. 

However, as to un-realism, the forwards reverse hull dancing thing that the tank players do, if anyone did that to any armored vehicle I was commanding, I'd kick them in the back between the shoulder blades as hard as I could WITH my hobnail boots. You want realism? How about tanks taking a second or two to shift from forwards to reverse. Abuse your gear box dancing, expect final drives to break or gear boxes. Gear box changes on crash gearboxes is NOT easy. Pre-selector gear boxes of the WWII time frame were far easier (Matilda for example). 

I've had the clutch in my 7 ton humber grenade because the driver dumped it badly starting and stopping roughly. There was no magic tool box to fix it with by pressing a button either. Increase that weight and power disparity more with a tank, half you guys would be making blue bell calls from the first hill or wall because you blew your drive lines. 

Iz game. Stop screaming about lack of realism with Armored Cars when you have numerous examples of grotesque fantasy surrounding how tanks drive, shift, don't break and are easy to fix. 

3161chromie #15 Posted May 16 2020 - 05:49

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View Postmustangbubba44, on Apr 06 2020 - 23:33, said:

I've totally lost it over this.....the game has come down to who has the better ebr players....it's that simple. I'm losing my enthusiasm for the game with these.


TOTALLY AGREE



Burhead06 #16 Posted May 16 2020 - 18:01

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fun fact , the ebr 105 doesnt go fast because of terrain resistance (it has worse terrain resistance than most lights , MUCH worse than a pz1c for instance , it goes fast because of a insane power to weight ratio powering through the terrain. 
 

not that its ability to move is the real issue with the tank itself.







Also tagged with Wheeled_Vehicles, Active_Scouting, Frontline, Artillery, Premium_Ammunition, Revisited_Topics, Racing, Stat_Padding, Running_Out_Of_Tag_Ideas

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