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Equipment 2.0: Provisional List of Concerns

Equipment Buffs Nerfs EBR Compeitive Solutions Fix

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7siiver7 #1 Posted May 29 2020 - 21:47

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  1. Low Tiers have less equipment slots than higher tier tanks
    "if tier 3 only have 2 slots for both equipment & consumables, yet can be matched against tier 4 & 5 (which have the usual three slots) then it's a de facto nerf for all tier 3 tanks."
     
  2. Binocular Telescopes only available for Tank Destroyers = completely breaks so many tanks (e.g passive scouts useless, EBR more OP)
    Coated Optics being removed for Tank Destroyers may also have similar concerns.
     
  3. Binocs / Net / Toolbox no longer demountable = new players struggle more , stock grinds more agonizing , game is overall more expensive & P2W
     
  4. Bounty/Improved Equipment more P2W
     
  5. Certain equipment will further buff certain tanks with min/maxed stats (e.g E25 + Experimental Powder)
     
  6. Certain tanks and strategies will be emphasized even more and upset competitive meta (i.e clan wars) 
    EBR will be more OP (e.g Improved Radio Set, Cmdr's Vision Sys) (this also concerns random battles)
    Buff to Turtle strategies (i.e Improved Hardening), as nothing is introduced to counter it.
     
  7. Heavies getting too fast? (e.g Obj 277 / Obj 260 + speed build)

     

POSSIBLE WAYS TO MITIGATE THESE ISSUES

 

  1. Allow all 3 equipment & consumable slots for all tiers, however these things for low tiers are provided for free (e.g tier 1-4)
    Perhaps only certain equipment can be available, not all, to reduce complexity & learning curve.
    This will not impact WG's profit, as low tiers are not WG's paying customer base. In fact, it may retain new players who will turn into paying customers later, while increasing the playerbase and longevity.
     
  2. Keep Binocs available for all tanks.
     
  3. If solution 1 is implemented, this will no longer be a problem. Otherwise, continue allowing free demounting for these 3 equipment.
     
  4. Only allow Bounty/Improved equipment stats have effect for competitive play (e.g tournaments, clan wars, ranked battles, etc.)
    Random battles will have standard stats (e.g Innovative Loading System will be 10% in Random Battles, and 13.5% in Clan Battles)
    If changing loadouts between random and competitive modes & constant demounting becomes an issue (too expensive), then create a two-loadout system -- one for random battles, the other for competitive. These loadouts will automatically be applied for free for the applicable game mode. However, demounting the equipment within the specified loadout will still cost gold.
     
  5. This is a harder problem to solve, by virtue of the fact that these only apply to specific tanks. Possibly the only effective solution would be to change the individual tank's stats themselves, however that is a problem in of itself.
     
  6. EBRs are simply OP, please nerf them asap.
    Perhaps only allow certain equipment in competitive modes? Random battles still have benefit of access to all equipment for diversity. Competitive meta will not be upset.
     
  7. Same issue as 5. Solution 6 might also be implemented here.

 

Edit: Clarified Solution 4: (e.g Innovative Loading System will be 10% in Random Battles, and 13.5% in Clan Battles)


Edited by 7siiver7, May 30 2020 - 00:05.


Digital_Malamute #2 Posted May 29 2020 - 21:51

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Makes no sense to limit Equipment slots based on tier when WG (1) allows new players to buy Premium tanks bypassing the alleged Tier safeguards, (2) pimps lower tier tanks as reward and freebees.

 

See June Premium shop offers here as a perfect example.

https://worldoftanks...-sneak-preview/

 

"WoT Premium Account Bundle — Buy 30 Days WoT Premium Account and get the German Großtraktor - Krupp Tier III medium tank, a Garage Slot, and 100% Crew — free!"

 

 

What should happen is the WoT Balance Department should be fired and CCs balance tanks instead of Equipment Gimmicks be used as a duct tape fix.



ByAnyMeansNecessary #3 Posted May 29 2020 - 21:54

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Anyone have a link to this?

Digital_Malamute #4 Posted May 29 2020 - 21:55

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View Post1BRAVO9, on May 29 2020 - 15:54, said:

Anyone have a link to this?

 

https://worldoftanks...-equipment-2-0/



TRK213_Turkey #5 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:00

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One slot for consumables seems stupid. 

ByAnyMeansNecessary #6 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:05

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View PostDigital_Malamute, on May 29 2020 - 14:55, said:

 

 

Thanks!



GWyatt #7 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:06

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https://worldoftanks.com/en/news/updates/sandbox-equipment-2-0/

ByAnyMeansNecessary #8 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:09

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One concern not mentioned is Improved Equipment, or any for that matter. Its just that it is more costly for IE.

 

If this is a complete rework, the same principles may not apply with what IE we have mounted.

 

And because they have changed the rules mid-game we should not have to pay for  bonds (or gold) to adapt to changes.

 

The only way I can see this transition in a reasonable manner is to either:

 

1) give us a weekend to demout and change without cost, bonds or gold.

2) or when the update hits completely strip every tank of equipment and let you remount as you deem fitting.

 

If they don't do one of those two it is a travesty.


Edited by 1BRAVO9, May 29 2020 - 22:11.


Ironmike11B #9 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:20

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This is the one I'm more concerned about. It increases the speed of changing direction when in motion. Wheeled vehicles +12% / +17.5%. Tracked vehicles +3% / +4%. WTH?? Don't wheelies change direction fast enough as is???

 



ez_money #10 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:24

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View PostIronmike11B, on May 29 2020 - 15:20, said:

This is the one I'm more concerned about. It increases the speed of changing direction when in motion. Wheeled vehicles +12% / +17.5%. Tracked vehicles +3% / +4%. WTH?? Don't wheelies change direction fast enough as is???

 

I noticed that one too. Actually wheeled vehicles have a very wide turning arc/radius, since they can't pivot like tracked vehicles. But nonetheless, the last thing we need is any more buffs for wheelies.



BadLuckCharm #11 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:40

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View PostDigital_Malamute, on May 29 2020 - 16:51, said:

 

What should happen is the WoT Balance Department should be fired and CCs balance tanks instead of Equipment Gimmicks be used as a duct tape fix.

 

Wasn't Murazor a CC? That went well...



BrianTheBomber #12 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:44

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View Post7siiver7, on May 29 2020 - 21:47, said:

  1. Low Tiers have less equipment slots than higher tier tanks
    "if tier 3 only have 2 slots for both equipment & consumables, yet can be matched against tier 4 & 5 (which have the usual three slots) then it's a de facto nerf for all tier 3 tanks."
     
  2. Binocular Telescopes only available for Tank Destroyers = completely breaks so many tanks (e.g passive scouts useless, EBR more OP)
    Coated Optics being removed for Tank Destroyers may also have similar concerns.
     
  3. Binocs / Net / Toolbox no longer demountable = new players struggle more , stock grinds more agonizing , game is overall more expensive & P2W
     
  4. Bounty/Improved Equipment more P2W
     
  5. Certain equipment will further buff certain tanks with min/maxed stats (e.g E25 + Experimental Powder)
     
  6. Certain tanks and strategies will be emphasized even more and upset competitive meta (i.e clan wars) 
    EBR will be more OP (e.g Improved Radio Set, Cmdr's Vision Sys) (this also concerns random battles)
    Buff to Turtle strategies (i.e Improved Hardening), as nothing is introduced to counter it.
     
  7. Heavies getting too fast? (e.g Obj 277 / Obj 260 + speed build)

     

POSSIBLE WAYS TO MITIGATE THESE ISSUES

 

  1. Allow all 3 equipment & consumable slots for all tiers, however these things for low tiers are provided for free (e.g tier 1-4)
    Perhaps only certain equipment can be available, not all, to reduce complexity & learning curve.
    This will not impact WG's profit, as low tiers are not WG's paying customer base. In fact, it may retain new players who will turn into paying customers later, while increasing the playerbase and longevity.
     
  2. Keep Binocs available for all tanks.
     
  3. If solution 1 is implemented, this will no longer be a problem. Otherwise, continue allowing free demounting for these 3 equipment.
     
  4. Only allow Bounty/Improved equipment stats have effect for competitive play (e.g tournaments, clan wars, ranked battles, etc.)
    Random battles will have standard stats.
    If changing loadouts between random and competitive modes & constant demounting becomes an issue (too expensive), then create a two-loadout system -- one for random battles, the other for competitive. These loadouts will automatically be applied for free for the applicable game mode. However, demounting the equipment within the specified loadout will still cost gold.
     
  5. This is a harder problem to solve, by virtue of the fact that these only apply to specific tanks. Possibly the only effective solution would be to change the individual tank's stats themselves, however that is a problem in of itself.
     
  6. EBRs are simply OP, please nerf them asap.
    Perhaps only allow certain equipment in competitive modes? Random battles still have benefit of access to all equipment for diversity. Competitive meta will not be upset.
     
  7. Same issue as 5. Solution 6 might also be implemented here.

Why do they always make changes none asked for, The game is ten years old and now they decided to revamp things. Since we have Zero say in this game except to pay or not, I hope this works out with as little pain as possible. 

 

Edit- If they take away a slot from tier 3 then pretty sure tier 3 and 4 will not meet anymore. wg has not done the best job but with things like this they normally take the least problematic approach. I like new equipment but why limit specific equipment to a class. I am not crazy about this idea but willing to give it a try. If this is implemented in a bad way and their ideas are no good I only hope it doesn't get pushed through. Hopefully all works well. 

 

Edit2- It looks like Improved eq is getting an indirect Nerf with the eq category specialization bonus only to Normal Eq.


Edited by BrianTheBomber, May 29 2020 - 23:03.


BrianTheBomber #13 Posted May 29 2020 - 22:50

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View Post1BRAVO9, on May 29 2020 - 22:09, said:

One concern not mentioned is Improved Equipment, or any for that matter. Its just that it is more costly for IE.

 

If this is a complete rework, the same principles may not apply with what IE we have mounted.

 

And because they have changed the rules mid-game we should not have to pay for  bonds (or gold) to adapt to changes.

 

The only way I can see this transition in a reasonable manner is to either:

 

1) give us a weekend to demout and change without cost, bonds or gold.

2) or when the update hits completely strip every tank of equipment and let you remount as you deem fitting.

 

If they don't do one of those two it is a travesty.

You can try this on the test server, But I think they should let people try thing out for a few days, Who has the Time to dl the TS. 

I can't speak for wg but I think they will pick number 2 or something close to it,


Edited by BrianTheBomber, May 29 2020 - 23:11.


Ironmike11B #14 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:05

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View Postez_money, on May 29 2020 - 15:24, said:

I noticed that one too. Actually wheeled vehicles have a very wide turning arc/radius, since they can't pivot like tracked vehicles. But nonetheless, the last thing we need is any more buffs for wheelies.

 

That's at slow speed.



Carde #15 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:09

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It would make sense to prohibit ebrs from getting the super good equipment.  I cannot fathom wargaming being so stupid as to further empower that stupid class.
 
 
 


HTTR4Life #16 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:10

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:popcorn:


Edited by HTTR4Life, May 29 2020 - 23:17.


BrianTheBomber #17 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:12

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nvm.  

 

Edited by BrianTheBomber, May 29 2020 - 23:14.


Burhead06 #18 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:19

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as far as making the improved equipment better = p2w , its getting buffed because normal equipment gets buffed if its in the right slot. the main p2w aspect of the improved equipment is it doesnt have a nerfed value if its in the wrong slot, but thats not p2w ImO.
 

for example , currently improved vents is 2.5% better than standard vents, in the new system , assuming you put normal vents in its proper slot. its only 2% stronger than the regular vents.



ThePigSheFlies #19 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:29

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  • For years we have complained about a lack of map development, complained about the map balance in some fashion or another, and the stupid physics of soapy rocks.
  • For years folks have complained that arty is too powerful/annoying/broken or the inverse depending on which side of the fence.
  • For years folks have complained about meta tanks, brokenly unbalanced tanks on release and/or clanwars meta tanks (a blind drunken ape could see that the 268v4 on release was absurdly over powered)
  • For a year now, EBRs have been the main complaint
  • For years, many folks have griped about premium ammo spam (I never have as I play paper tanks and get auto-aimed penned anyway)

 

What's wargaming do?  They basically abandon premium ammo super tests and dream up sweeping changes for crews and equipment...

Wargaming wants your money, but they also want, and need your participation in the player queues in order to have a viable game...    



heavymetal1967 #20 Posted May 29 2020 - 23:50

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Hell the fact they're changing up equipment effects substantially means there may be better gear than we're running now or gear combos. 

 

The fact they are NOT demounting all of our equipment is Bravo Sierra.  Convert something that I may no longer want because of the substantial changes you made ain't a fair or equitable consideration Wargaming.

 

New equipment won't all be demounted for free it seems.  Not sure, but they're NOT repeat NOT saying all our gear will be demounted for free.

 

I've got around 535 tanks.  Granted I'm probably on the extreme end, but there are other folks like me or those with 100 plus.  And folks with 25 plus tanks equipped with mostly demountable gear are fairly common I imagine.

 

Sure some of mine have no gear and some have nets, binos and or toolboxes.  But most of them have one two and often three pieces of gear mounted.  And with this change nets, binos and toolboxes will not be demountable.

 

https://worldoftanks.com/en/news/updates/sandbox-equipment-2-0/

 

Block Quote

 In addition, we'll provide you with a number of Demount Kits to remove your old equipment for free by completing special battle missions (Sandbox battle missions are for testing purposes only and the conditions may vary upon feature release).

 

  • Old equipment will be replaced by new equipment, taking into account the specifics of the reworked system. For example, the Medium-Caliber Gun Rammers for tanks and SPGs will become Gun Rammer Class 2, so you can mount it on the Tier V–VII vehicles and Tier VIII–X tanks with which it was previously compatible. The Large-Caliber Gun Rammers for tanks and SPGs will become Gun Rammer Class 1 and be suitable for Tier VIII–X tanks.
  • If any equipment has already been mounted on a vehicle, then the tier of this specific tank will not be considered. For example, a Tier II vehicle with Coated Optics costing 500,000 credits, when all changes take effect, will have Coated Optics Class 1, which is designed for Tier VIII–X tanks. But this equipment will remain on the Tier II tank, and you can freely enter battle with it. If you demount this equipment, you'll be able to mount it on any vehicle that uses this specific class of equipment. However, you won’t be able to mount it on other vehicles that use a different class of this specific equipment.
  • If any equipment was mounted on a tank for which it can no longer be used in the new system (for example, due to a different vehicle type), it will be automatically moved to the Depot and converted.
  • Moving equipment from one slot to another on the same vehicle isn't considered demounting and therefore doesn't require spending gold, bonds, or Demount Kits.
  • In some cases, the equipment cost will increase. On the one hand, we want to take into account the interests of players who purchase new equipment. On the other hand, we also take into account the interests of commanders who already have this equipment and may want to sell it. So the new price will remain quite affordable for the widest range of commanders.
  • For vehicles that will have fewer equipment slots in the new system, on the Sandbox server, all equipment from non-existent slots will be removed to the Depot.
  • After the feature is released, each player will receive several free Demount Kits. You'll also be able to earn more Demount Kits by completing special daily missions for a limited time.

 

 

 







Also tagged with Equipment, Buffs, Nerfs, EBR, Compeitive, Solutions, Fix

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