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Say what you want about wheeled tanks


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_Tuwtles_ #1 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 00:43

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Remember when people used to say that arty was the only thing standing between a relatively well-paced battle and 15 minute draws every match? And then people who were not bad at the game told them they were wrong and that what actually progressed the battle and prevented camping was people playing aggressively in mediums and lights? It's funny that the wheeled tanks have perfectly displayed how extraneous artillery is as a class, and how completely useless it is to the random battle experience. It's only natural that people, and I would surmise that most of them are arty players, voraciously call for the wheeled tanks to be nerfed. It makes perfect sense though, because in most scenarios the wheeled lights are the only ones able to kill scummy artillery players before they can drown themselves. So naturally, the arty players are infuriated. To be quite honest, nobody who is good at this game has an exceptionally difficult time hitting and destroying them. It's mainly the addled boomers who have reaction times in the vicinity of multiple seconds.

24_inch_pythons #2 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 01:02

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View Post_Tuwtles_, on Jun 30 2020 - 17:43, said:

Remember when people used to say that arty was the only thing standing between a relatively well-paced battle and 15 minute draws every match? And then people who were not bad at the game told them they were wrong and that what actually progressed the battle and prevented camping was people playing aggressively in mediums and lights? It's funny that the wheeled tanks have perfectly displayed how extraneous artillery is as a class, and how completely useless it is to the random battle experience. It's only natural that people, and I would surmise that most of them are arty players, voraciously call for the wheeled tanks to be nerfed. It makes perfect sense though, because in most scenarios the wheeled lights are the only ones able to kill scummy artillery players before they can drown themselves. So naturally, the arty players are infuriated. To be quite honest, nobody who is good at this game has an exceptionally difficult time hitting and destroying them. It's mainly the addled boomers who have reaction times in the vicinity of multiple seconds.

 

No.

If wheeled vehicles were somehow restricted from operating until only the end -- when they are actually needed to root out invisi-tds -- so the team with the lead / advantage can actually push the advantage they earned and win, then yes, I would say they are fine. But, when they can pin an entire 15 man enemy team down in the first 30 seconds of the game and keep them from getting into positions to fight over... then they've ruined the game.



JakeTheMystic #3 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 01:44

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While arty may promote a camping mindset, it's also realistically the only thing that can easily break camps. You should know this from clan wars specifically, how many climbs were really only dealt with easily by arty where any other tank couldnt. Sure there are some maps like Redshire or Mountain Pass that arty can't break a camp on, but there are plenty of others that arty is almost a necessity. 

Yes, arty is a nuisance and a lot of people want it gone, i'd at least like it limited to 2 because 3 arty focusing me makes the game unplayable. Out of the 900+ battles this month maybe 7/10 of them had 3-arty games that made the game incredibly difficult to play in. Wheelies make certain maps difficult to play as it makes other lights irrelevant. Mali, Muro, Prok, Westfield, ect, ect. Any open map (or any map for a field for that matter) an EBR will out brawl any other light, specifically the 8 premium and 10 need to be reworked for that matter. That's the problem I have with it at least, not so much that they cant be hit. As for the wheel eating shots, sure that's annoying but i'm glad that's being addressed next patch. 

Overall, both classes suck and made the game less fun to play. 

RHeadshot #4 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 01:50

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The problem with clown cars is that they are so absurdly over powered, over armored, and have physically impossible maneuverability.  Next thing you know an infantry will be able to stand toe to toe with a Maus and beat it.  As implemented by the "geniuses" at WG, clown cars make about as much sense as a small firecracker knocking down a skyscraper.

2MOEJOE #5 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 01:54

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Our lord and savior 000001% player has come down from the mountain with his righteous decree. We as middle aged sh&%&ers must abide because  being the perma blue POS I am have no say our lord has spoken.

I_QQ_4_U #6 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 01:54

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Why would arty players care about AC's? They've had pretty much zero effect on me playing SPG's other than they are really hard to hit. To be honest it seems that those that complain the most about them don't play SPG's that much.

bake3020 #7 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 02:12

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Wheeled cancer is killing this game and needs to go.  I do play arty but I also play so much else too.  So OP, your premise is absolutely untrue.

_Tuwtles_ #8 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 03:12

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View PostJakeTheMystic, on Jun 30 2020 - 17:44, said:

While arty may promote a camping mindset, it's also realistically the only thing that can easily break camps. You should know this from clan wars specifically, how many climbs were really only dealt with easily by arty where any other tank couldnt. Sure there are some maps like Redshire or Mountain Pass that arty can't break a camp on, but there are plenty of others that arty is almost a necessity. 

Yes, arty is a nuisance and a lot of people want it gone, i'd at least like it limited to 2 because 3 arty focusing me makes the game unplayable. Out of the 900+ battles this month maybe 7/10 of them had 3-arty games that made the game incredibly difficult to play in. Wheelies make certain maps difficult to play as it makes other lights irrelevant. Mali, Muro, Prok, Westfield, ect, ect. Any open map (or any map for a field for that matter) an EBR will out brawl any other light, specifically the 8 premium and 10 need to be reworked for that matter. That's the problem I have with it at least, not so much that they cant be hit. As for the wheel eating shots, sure that's annoying but i'm glad that's being addressed next patch. 

Overall, both classes suck and made the game less fun to play. 

 

That's why I specified that arty has no use in random battles. I said nothing about competitive because that's the only place where arty is useful.



_Tuwtles_ #9 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 03:15

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View Post2MOEJOE, on Jun 30 2020 - 17:54, said:

Our lord and savior 000001% player has come down from the mountain with his righteous decree. We as middle aged sh&%&ers must abide because  being the perma blue POS I am have no say our lord has spoken.

 

Maybe if you weren't so senile you could be purple.



_Tuwtles_ #10 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 03:18

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View Postbake3020, on Jun 30 2020 - 18:12, said:

Wheeled cancer is killing this game and needs to go.  I do play arty but I also play so much else too.  So OP, your premise is absolutely untrue.

 

My entire premise is literally git gud.



jeb2 #11 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 03:30

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View Post_Tuwtles_, on Jul 01 2020 - 00:43, said:

Remember when people used to say that arty was the only thing standing between a relatively well-paced battle and 15 minute draws every match? And then people who were not bad at the game told them they were wrong and that what actually progressed the battle and prevented camping was people playing aggressively in mediums and lights? It's funny that the wheeled tanks have perfectly displayed how extraneous artillery is as a class, and how completely useless it is to the random battle experience. It's only natural that people, and I would surmise that most of them are arty players, voraciously call for the wheeled tanks to be nerfed. It makes perfect sense though, because in most scenarios the wheeled lights are the only ones able to kill scummy artillery players before they can drown themselves. So naturally, the arty players are infuriated. To be quite honest, nobody who is good at this game has an exceptionally difficult time hitting and destroying them. It's mainly the addled boomers who have reaction times in the vicinity of multiple seconds.

 

Have you watched the replay by Guido in the thread here:

 

http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/629838-about-wheeled-tanks/#topmost



__WarChild__ #12 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 03:45

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I do not see why wheeled vehicles needed to be brought into the game.  And now that they are here, the fact that well aimed shots do nothing material to them is absolutely stupid.  For the highly skilled and the simply fun crowd, they are a great tool.  But there is no doubt that their existence changes too much with this game and makes too many things irrelevant and creates too many situations where the focus is exclusively on them instead of "regular" game play.  I understand why the OP likes them and there are many great players in his camp on that issue, but for me and the majority of players, they are detrimental.

AllieOop2 #13 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 04:38

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View Post_Tuwtles_, on Jul 01 2020 - 03:18, said:

 

My entire premise is literally git gud.


This old tired worn out line should be shoved so far up the place where the sun doesn't shine until it makes your nose bleed. This BS line is NOT the cure for all the ills of the game. It also is absurdly impossible in any game that all players get good. Yes there are people that play at such an absurdly bad level in the game that all the broken crap could be fixed an it would make no difference. THE POINT of fixing an talking about areas of the game that are so broken it makes the general player population dislike logging into the game. THAT ISN'T a problem in your eyes? If so get good at common business sense and pull your tomato head out of your rectum. Bad or good player keep the game open an enjoy logging in. Player having NO FUN good or bad quit playing an the game shuts down. You could take a screen shot of your get good stats you had an post them in your resume but at that point its pretty much worthless.



Burhead06 #14 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 04:54

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View Post24_inch_pythons, on Jul 01 2020 - 00:02, said:

 

No.

If wheeled vehicles were somehow restricted from operating until only the end -- when they are actually needed to root out invisi-tds -- so the team with the lead / advantage can actually push the advantage they earned and win, then yes, I would say they are fine. But, when they can pin an entire 15 man enemy team down in the first 30 seconds of the game and keep them from getting into positions to fight over... then they've ruined the game.

you honestly believe a single ebr is single handedly "can pin an entire 15 man enemy team down in the first 30 seconds"? really?

View PostRHeadshot, on Jul 01 2020 - 00:50, said:

The problem with clown cars is that they are so absurdly over powered, over armored, and have physically impossible maneuverability.  Next thing you know an infantry will be able to stand toe to toe with a Maus and beat it.  As implemented by the "geniuses" at WG, clown cars make about as much sense as a small firecracker knocking down a skyscraper.

alot of tanks in this game can do impossible things. and over armored? aside from awkward glitchy interactions with he shells and non modeled hitboxes blocking he shells (note im saying specifically he shells) they are not "over armored" is it annoying if your shell hits under the hull and does no damage? sure it is. but if you missed the hull you dont do damage , why should that change with an ebr.

View Post__WarChild__, on Jul 01 2020 - 02:45, said:

I do not see why wheeled vehicles needed to be brought into the game.  And now that they are here, the fact that well aimed shots do nothing material to them is absolutely stupid.  For the highly skilled and the simply fun crowd, they are a great tool.  But there is no doubt that their existence changes too much with this game and makes too many things irrelevant and creates too many situations where the focus is exclusively on them instead of "regular" game play.  I understand why the OP likes them and there are many great players in his camp on that issue, but for me and the majority of players, they are detrimental.

i mean alot of people could have strong opinions on alot of tanks and why the should never have been brought into the game. just makes it a opinion
as mentioned above , if a "well aimed shot" misses the hull , that means that either rng said no (which happens to literally every tank in the game vs literally every tank in the game) or it wasn't quite so well an aimed shot. outside of the wonky interactions with he shells which i 100% agree needs to be fixed. there isn't a ton of instances where shells do "nothing material" 

unless you are talking about when you miss the hull , hit a wheel and it doesn't impact speed enough , which i agree should be fixed (and seems to be one of the big things on the docket for the inc balance changes to them which i agree with)
as far as  "the majority of players" you could make an argument that a majority of the forums might dislike them sure. but its really really hard to say thats accurate for the whole player base. thats similar to saying that just because 1 group of people hate something it means everybody does. a very small % of the overall player base is on the forums. so its a fallacy to state  that a majority of the players hate them. (im sure you could probably make a better argument that a majority think they deserve some balance changes, but hate them/wants them entirely out of the game? naw thats a big nope unless you have some hidden resources i dont know of)

for clarification because i know somebody is going to try to label me as an ebr fanboy etc.... i think they need balance changes , just not to the degree alot of people on the forums think and definitely not in the way alot of the people on the forums think.



24_inch_pythons #15 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 05:10

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View PostBurhead06, on Jun 30 2020 - 21:54, said:

you honestly believe a single ebr is single handedly "can pin an entire 15 man enemy team down in the first 30 seconds"? really?

 

I've seen it. So have you.



Anlushac11 #16 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 05:16

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What pisses me off about wheeled vehicles is on some maps you cant get to a position without being spotted in first 30 seconds of game and getting arty spammed. So you lose 1/2 health or dead sometimes when your just outside your base, havent even had a chance to move anywhere.

 

The other is hitting a speeding wheeled vehicle dead on direct hit on side of a clown car with 20mm side armor with 128mm gun with 246mm pen... and I get a message failed to penetrate.



Burhead06 #17 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 05:38

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View Post24_inch_pythons, on Jul 01 2020 - 04:10, said:

I've seen it. So have you.

no i haven't , because 1v15 the ebr never wins , it just doesn't ,  unless the enemy team is so inept at the game that they dont even know how to press lmb



Ramsalot #18 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:41

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View PostBurhead06, on Jun 30 2020 - 20:38, said:

no i haven't , because 1v15 the ebr never wins , it just doesn't ,  unless the enemy team is so inept at the game that they dont even know how to press lmb

Today I have seen a single EBR spot half our team in the first 30 seconds, and we lost one T57 just outside the base trying to get into position, it was focused by three T10 arty players.  Next we lost M48 Patton that almost made it to cover, to same three top tier arty.  That is in the starting minute or two, without any shots being landed by our team.



I_QQ_4_U #19 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:47

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View PostRamsalot, on Jul 01 2020 - 06:41, said:

Today I have seen a single EBR spot half our team in the first 30 seconds, and we lost one T57 just outside the base trying to get into position, it was focused by three T10 arty players.  Next we lost M48 Patton that almost made it to cover, to same three top tier arty.  That is in the starting minute or two, without any shots being landed by our team.

 

Great story, got a replay? I'd love to see three tier 10 arty take out two tanks in the first minute or two when 4 of the 5 have 40+ second reloads.



ProfessionalFinn #20 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:50

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What a transformation. Remember when clown-cars were adored because they would clean-up on the hated arty?  Now scores of anti-arty whiners flipped and despise the clown-car even more than arty. 
My appreciation for the wheeled vehicle is on the rise.  

 

 

 






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