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Why does the Maus have a tier 8 TD gun? Why not the others from WW2

Maus German russian bias Under powered Nerfed Power creep Armor deficient poor front turret armor.

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marc_2018 #1 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:03

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Why does the Maus (Panzer VIII) only have the 128mm, which is a tier 8 TD gun on the RHM?

In 1943 the mockup was modified to have a 150mm after the 128mm looked like a toy gun on such a huge tank.

 

Maybe it needs the 17cm Stuk L/53 gun

 

It would be nice if wg gave it an armament worthy of a tier 10 tank.  Even the E100 (smaller) has a larger gun.

German medium tanks at tier 9 & 10 have 278 pen with a 105 (but the tank is not WW2).

 

Since it is a fantasy game and not Historical, why not fix it.

 

Besides the dismal 128mm, wg could do something unique with that coaxial 75mm.

5 shot auto cannon for wheeled vehicles?

 

I do find it strange that most German tanks in the game are WW2 vintage at the upper tiers,

while the other nations are post WW2 designs.

 

Anyway, discuss and cus with tinfoil hats as needed....



SquiggyMcPew #2 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:14

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View Postmarc_2018, on Jul 01 2020 - 06:03, said:

I do find it strange that most German tanks in the game are WW2 vintage at the upper tiers,

while the other nations are post WW2 designs.

 

Mostly because the loser in a genocidal war of extermination doesn't get to have a home grown military for a while. It wasn't until the russians looked to be the new germans that west germany got its arms manufacturing back in any real capacity with new r&d.



TheJeep1 #3 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:16

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I believe the German Super Heavies were designed (game) to be shields to attract enemy aggro, only firing occasionally.   Weather players play them that way is different topic.

Burhead06 #4 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:21

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because tier 8 tds typcially have guns equivalent to the guns of regular tanks 1 or 2 tiers above them. 

unless your actually trying to argue that it needs a higher caliber gun than a 128 purely because the caliber is too low. which is funny.

theres also the biggest reason , it historically used a 128, and typically when possible the devs try to mount tanks with weapons they historically used. there are very few exceptions to this.

tanopasman62 #5 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 06:57

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tbh if they gave it Jagdtiger's top gun it would be borderline OP

PTwr #6 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 07:12

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View PostTheJeep1, on Jul 01 2020 - 05:16, said:

I believe the German Super Heavies were designed (game) to be shields to attract enemy aggro, only firing occasionally.   Weather players play them that way is different topic.

Yes. Back in 2011 it worked that way, when their armor actually could bounce something. 



PatoThe #7 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 08:05

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tier 8 TD has Maus gun lol

ARCNA442 #8 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 08:48

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View PostBurhead06, on Jul 01 2020 - 00:21, said:

theres also the biggest reason , it historically used a 128, and typically when possible the devs try to mount tanks with weapons they historically used. there are very few exceptions to this.

 

LOL - let's run through the mass produced historic tanks of the German tech tree:

Leopard 1 - real gun

Jagdtiger - fake gun (should be 128mm L55)

Ferdinand - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger II - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Jagdpanther - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger I - fake gun (should be 88mm L56)

Panther - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

Nashorn - real gun

Jagdpanzer IV - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

StuG IIIG - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

Panzer IVH - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

StuG IIIB - real gun

Panzer IIIJ - real gun

Luchs - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer IIIE - real gun

Panzer IIG - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer II - fake gun (should be 20mm)

 



awildseaking #9 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 09:30

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View PostARCNA442, on Jul 01 2020 - 02:48, said:

 

LOL - let's run through the mass produced historic tanks of the German tech tree:

Leopard 1 - real gun

Jagdtiger - fake gun (should be 128mm L55)

Ferdinand - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger II - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Jagdpanther - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger I - fake gun (should be 88mm L56)

Panther - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

Nashorn - real gun

Jagdpanzer IV - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

StuG IIIG - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

Panzer IVH - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

StuG IIIB - real gun

Panzer IIIJ - real gun

Luchs - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer IIIE - real gun

Panzer IIG - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer II - fake gun (should be 20mm)

 

Lots of tanks mount fake guns, but it's particularly egregious for the Germans. Really shows how badly WG botched the tiering. Maybe it made sense in 2010, but not today.

 

That "other" game frequently retiers. I think WG should explore this possibility.



Fractured_Raptor #10 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 13:02

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View Posttanopasman62, on Jul 01 2020 - 00:57, said:

tbh if they gave it Jagdtiger's top gun it would be borderline OP

 

Not if you balance it right. It's easy to give a tank a bigger gun if you cut back the alpha and/or increase reload time. Just because it's the same gun doesn't mean it needs to have the same reload. This game isn't meant to be pure fact. Otherwise wheelies would die the second any tank shell so much as farted in their general direction. 



9999bc #11 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 13:29

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About 21 cm Mörser 18/2? This will teach the hull down tanks not to mess the Maus.

pyantoryng #12 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 13:32

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View PostPatoThe, on Jul 01 2020 - 07:05, said:

tier 8 TD has Maus gun lol

 

Keep in mind that TDs ended at tier 9 back when the Haus was THE top dog (so there's only Object 704 and Jagdtiger at the end of it all)...and TDs back then were all casemates so having that kinda gun on a turret was something of a marvel in those days.

 

View PostFractured_Raptor, on Jul 01 2020 - 12:02, said:

 

Not if you balance it right. It's easy to give a tank a bigger gun if you cut back the alpha and/or increase reload time. Just because it's the same gun doesn't mean it needs to have the same reload. This game isn't meant to be pure fact. Otherwise wheelies would die the second any tank shell so much as farted in their general direction. 

 

The Panzer VII already uses the 12.8 L/61 but it fires significantly slower than the Jagdtiger (3.75 RPM without any modifers) and with worse dispersion so as things stand it might just obsolete said tank completely if the same gun is to be used on the Haus?



SquiggyMcPew #13 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 13:45

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View Posttanopasman62, on Jul 01 2020 - 06:57, said:

tbh if they gave it Jagdtiger's top gun it would be borderline OP

 

I'd say the current batch of meta tanks are all borderline op so why not give the maus it's day in the sun? It's not like they can't nerf it again at a later date like they do to all the meta tanks to allow other tanks to be meta for a while. Hell some game devs use exactly that method to keep the game fresh like eve online which goes through regular rebalances to boost a certain segment of ships and leave the others a bit under powered so it promotes having a large selection of ships to choose from instead of tunneling right for the op stuff.



Trauglodyte #14 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 14:41

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Well, first off, it is NOT a tier 8 gun.  It is a tier 10 gun that happens to be on a tier 8 TD.  Clearly, if you look at the gun, in the garage, you'll see this symbol "X" on top of it.

 

Secondly, it isn't the gun, that is holding the Maus back.  Premium ammo is the primary culprit, since the game was never balanced around it.  You could argue, point of fact, that it is what causes imbalances now.

 

Finally, don't you ever get tired of sounding like a massive whiney turd?  I've got you, on ignore.  Yet, because I can't ignore you topics, I'm still subjected to your daily whinging crap, day in and day out.  Nobody cares.  And, quite frankly, if you spent the time posting in the game, instead, trying to get better, the rest of us wouldn't have to deal with your bad 48.7% win rate garbage.  STOP!

 

View PostARCNA442, on Jul 01 2020 - 08:48, said:

 

LOL - let's run through the mass produced historic tanks of the German tech tree:

Leopard 1 - real gun

Jagdtiger - fake gun (should be 128mm L55)

Ferdinand - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger II - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Jagdpanther - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger I - fake gun (should be 88mm L56)

Panther - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

Nashorn - real gun

Jagdpanzer IV - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

StuG IIIG - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

Panzer IVH - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

StuG IIIB - real gun

Panzer IIIJ - real gun

Luchs - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer IIIE - real gun

Panzer IIG - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer II - fake gun (should be 20mm)

 

 

I would surmise that this exists because German gun pen values were greater than their same tier peers.  That is something that you'll see all over the place.  Plus, if we're talking just the game mechanic of "leveling", you've got to have carrots, on sticks, for the populace.  Unlike the Tiger, not every tank could be built, in game, with a production run, from test to final.  You could do it, with the Pz. III and Pz. IV, if they just named them that and went through the various guns of the variants.  For everything else, though, you're kind of humped.


Edited by Trauglodyte, Jul 01 2020 - 14:44.


marc_2018 #15 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 15:12

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Reported Trauglodyte.  Shameful language.  You really should play more and investigate the game.

I post what is going on as other players should know.  Surely a cavedweller such as yourself, needs

education.


 

I used to have a 55% win rate before all the BS one sided matches got worse in December.  It would be

nice to play the game and depend on the other players on the team instead of them yoloing, drowning

or cliff diving. It would not be bad if it was an occassional game, but constant!


 

Yes, premium rounds are a factor.  The other is power creep.  Another is th bias crap.  Wheeled vehicles,

tanks with twin guns etc....  But really, the Maus having a glaring frontal weak turret?  Lower plate I get

as that is common for German tanks.  A 246 pen gun on a Teir 10 super heavy.  Try penning a russian tier 10

heavy with that without premium.  Event with Premium you get bounces from the front, even in the weak spots.


 

Anyway, be ignorent of whats going on with the game and continue to stop caring.  Surely you should take some

courses on progamming as it appears your a bit lacking. Did you dive off a cliff or drown yourself yet today?

Seems like you would be one of those types to preserve your record.  Maybe you feed wg with plenty of $.

Fool if you do.


 

Enjoy.


 


 

 



redjkent #16 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 16:06

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the gun is great on it has good pin, maybe it doesn't do 600 damage a shot, but id take the shorter reload then the e100 has with its 150

Cupujoe #17 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 16:16

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View Postmarc_2018, on Jul 01 2020 - 15:12, said:

Reported Trauglodyte. 

LOL.

This is hilarious. 

If anyone should be reported it's you, Marc_2018, 

for constantly spamming the forum with your same tinfoil theories and whines.

 



Burhead06 #18 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 16:22

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View PostARCNA442, on Jul 01 2020 - 07:48, said:

 

LOL - let's run through the mass produced historic tanks of the German tech tree:

Leopard 1 - real gun

Jagdtiger - fake gun (should be 128mm L55)

Ferdinand - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger II - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Jagdpanther - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger I - fake gun (should be 88mm L56)

Panther - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

Nashorn - real gun

Jagdpanzer IV - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

StuG IIIG - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

Panzer IVH - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

StuG IIIB - real gun

Panzer IIIJ - real gun

Luchs - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer IIIE - real gun

Panzer IIG - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer II - fake gun (should be 20mm)

 

just fyi , the jag does mount the pak 44 l55 , it just also mounts a better gun, when i said most tanks mount their historical gun i meant just that , most tanks mount it, does not mean they can ONLY mount it , as theres typically stock grinds and sometimes they make the historical load out the stock loadout. doesn't change how accurate my statement was.

View PostFractured_Raptor, on Jul 01 2020 - 12:02, said:

 

Not if you balance it right. It's easy to give a tank a bigger gun if you cut back the alpha and/or increase reload time. Just because it's the same gun doesn't mean it needs to have the same reload. This game isn't meant to be pure fact. Otherwise wheelies would die the second any tank shell so much as farted in their general direction. 

the silly thing is that the jagtiger gun is also a 128 its not a "bigger" gun , it just has tweaked stats.



deathman254 #19 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 16:24

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View PostARCNA442, on Jul 01 2020 - 07:48, said:

 

LOL - let's run through the mass produced historic tanks of the German tech tree:

Leopard 1 - real gun

Jagdtiger - fake gun (should be 128mm L55)

Ferdinand - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger II - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Jagdpanther - fake gun (should be 88mm L71)

Tiger I - fake gun (should be 88mm L56)

Panther - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

Nashorn - real gun

Jagdpanzer IV - fake gun (should be 75mm L70)

StuG IIIG - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

Panzer IVH - fake gun (should be 75mm L48)

StuG IIIB - real gun

Panzer IIIJ - real gun

Luchs - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer IIIE - real gun

Panzer IIG - fake gun (should be 20mm)

Panzer II - fake gun (should be 20mm)

 

Now I could be wrong because I can't check it right now but all of those tanks have those guns as options with some slightly better ones that were tested but never implemented as options as well. You can still run all of those guns on those tanks. They may not be the best but they are options.



Burhead06 #20 Posted Jul 01 2020 - 16:37

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View Postdeathman254, on Jul 01 2020 - 15:24, said:

Now I could be wrong because I can't check it right now but all of those tanks have those guns as options with some slightly better ones that were tested but never implemented as options as well. You can still run all of those guns on those tanks. They may not be the best but they are options.

yup , going down the list the 
jag can mount the correct gun
ferdi can mount correct gun
tiger 2 can mount correct gun
jadgpanther DOES mount the "correct" gun as its top gun funny how he fudged the "facts" on this tank even more than others
tiger 1 can mount correct gun

panther can mount correct gun

jagdpanther IV can mount correct gun
stug IIIG can mount correct gun

panzer IVH can mount correct gun
luchs which 20mm is it supposed to be? it has 2. :trollface:
panzer IIG again , which 20mm is it supposed to be? it has 2 (p.s. since you may just not have known 2cm = 20mm. i know the naming difference must be hard but im sure you'll manage)
panzer II oh boy , this ones gonna sting , the panzer II has 3 20mm guns , and its "top gun" (the gun with the highest tier) is also 20mm

honestly i feel like this guy is just trying to bait me into giving him a point.






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