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Italian HT's screenshots from Test Server


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PTwr #1 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:11

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Bla bla, not final, bla bla, can change without notice etc.

 

TLDR: fat, clusmy, copy of MT line. More alpha in trade for mobility.

 

XP costs:

Tier 7: 57750 tank + 9500 + 12000 + 12500 + 20000 in modules (free radio from lower tiers)

Tier 8: 87200 tank + 17000 + 27000 + 7300 + 16000 + 25000 in modules

Tier 9: 150190 tank + 25000 + 27300 + 47000 + 9400 + 25000 + 55000 + 62000

Tier 10: 209860 tank

Total: 873500xp, 621000xp if you skip tiers.

 

As predicted its a line built of xp sinks, designed to goad you to skip tiers with power of gold. Disgustingly long stock grind, xp hidden in weak upgrades, tier 9 top gun designed for gold spam, etc etc.

All you get from fully researched MT's is a dinky radio on tier 7.

 

All of them can mount everything without upgrading tracks, but you might have problem fitting in equipment.

 

 

 

Tech tree:

Spoiler

 

Tier 6, P43 bis. Starting point.

Spoiler

 

Tier 7 Carro d'assalto P.88

Midtier trash designed to frustrate you into skipping tiers. Basically P43 with German 88's somehow fitted into that tiny turret. No autoloader.

Look at that sweet 0.42 base dispersion. Woohooo.

Spoiler

 

Tier 8 Progetto CC55 mod. 54

Thats a Patton-style hull with Pattonish turret on top. So original. Seems like Cold War tonks starts here.

Upgraded turret gets impressive looking mantlet. 100mm @ 45 angle... which is just dinky ~140mm so no hull down for you anyway.

Good sides? Good stock gun, but not much of an upgrade later on.

Seems like WG want's us to play tier 8, to observe how much better premium tanks are ;]

Spoiler

 

Tier 9 Progetto C50 mod. 66

What is that stock turret supposed to be?! Return of ARL-44 The Barn?

Continuing with Pattonish hull, this time twice the flat surfaces for artillery to land on, you get something that tries to be hull-down but forgot turret armor in garage.

Designed to make skipping economically viable choice (seriously, just throw blueprint and freexp turret+gun if you want tier 10). You can "quickly" reach gun upgrade for 55k... or just add 32k more for top gun.

But wait! Top gun is derpier, has worse AP pen, has only 22mm more gold pen, and gold is HEAT, and clip is smaller. is 80 (25%) more alpha worth it? Ehh... I got mixed feelings.

And that 74k xp in engines... ugh.

Spoiler

 

Tier 10 Rhinoceronte

Its not French-style oscillating turret. Its Sweedish type, like in Emils or UDES MT's.

Again Patton hull. Again no face armor. But this time face is so much in rear that it might be not visible in hulldown.

Spoiler

 


Edited by PTwr, Jan 05 2021 - 20:16.


PapioTitan #2 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:19

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but but but the improved loading mechanic......

ThePigSheFlies #3 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:22

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the tier 10 also has a 3 man crew, so it doesn't match the premium that so many people overspent on boxes to get.

 

I tossed a 9 perk crew in it, bond equipment + turbocharger.  in game set-up showed that resulted in ~2100 dpg (with food) and it still felt fairly sluggish for a heavium. 

 

the gun depression was a bit suprising, the top of the breach pokes out of the u-shaped turret, similar to the tier 10 rhm panzer wagon's gun does. 

 

map was murovanka, enemy had 2 man EBR platoon that raped and pillaged, and the rest of the team died too fast for me to materially impact the battle in a 2 -15 route.

I ended up with 2800 or 2900 damage, and honestly felt like I was reloading the entire battle.

 

aside from not really liking heavies anyway, I'm not sure I see much entertainment in this line.  shell velocities currently on the tier 10's gun.  ~700ish m/s on both the HEAT and HE (which has 127mm pen) and ~1400m/s on the APCR.



teamoldmill #4 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:28

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T7 and 8 actually appear to have decent armor mostly. Tanksgg shows the small area at turret front on the 7 is not great, but ufp and most of side better than Tiger. The turret on the 8, while not thick, is at minimum 230 effective frontally. Both are faster. Certainly not armored brawlers, but not weakly armored as it sounds. No idea what to make of T10, looks... weird. Hull down well?

 

But no, does not look very solid at first glance, I agree.



PTwr #5 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:34

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View PostPapioTitan, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:19, said:

but but but the improved loading mechanic......

Meh. I played Bisonte few dozen time and I can tell you three things about it:

  1. It beeps so much you feel like driving R2D2
  2. Its just a half-useless crutch in case you screwed up half-clipping. If you need to shot early you are most likely getting killed anyway
  3. Its overcomplicated in scope which, when coupled with all those beeps and boops, makes me shot too early way too often because I am used to normal-autoreloader of MT's.

 

View PostThePigSheFlies, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:22, said:

the tier 10 also has a 3 man crew, so it doesn't match the premium that so many people overspent on boxes to get.

Oh man, that loader switch SUCKS. At least its on crew with least exciting skills. (Ain't shell prediction thingy even working on proggies?)

 

View PostThePigSheFlies, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:22, said:

map was murovanka, enemy had 2 man EBR platoon that raped and pillaged, and the rest of the team died too fast for me to materially impact the battle in a 2 -15 route.

I ended up with 2800 or 2900 damage, and honestly felt like I was reloading the entire battle.

That's pretty much how I remember my time in Bisonte. Either sucky single shooter or relooooaaaaadddiiiiiinnnnnnggg. Much harder to (ab)use Italian clip without mobility. Most of time when I clipped out was because enemy rushed in and I was dead few seconds later.

Classic clip seems to fit HT's better.... if you can call that line HT in first place.

 

View PostThePigSheFlies, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:22, said:

aside from not really liking heavies anyway, I'm not sure I see much entertainment in this line.  shell velocities currently on the tier 10's gun.  ~700ish m/s on both the HEAT and HE (which has 127mm pen) and ~1400m/s on the APCR.

THAT IS HORRIBLE.

I forgot about shell velocities. That's it, I am grinding through tier 9 with that sidegun with APCR :]

 

View Postteamoldmill, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:28, said:

T7 and 8 actually appear to have decent armor mostly. Tanksgg shows the small area at turret front on the 7 is not great, but ufp and most of side better than Tiger. The turret on the 8, while not thick, is at minimum 230 effective frontally. Both are faster. Certainly not armored brawlers, but not weakly armored as it sounds. No idea what to make of T10, looks... weird. Hull down well?

 

But no, does not look very solid at first glance, I agree.

Ah indeed. Tier got nice mantlet. But its dispersions gives enough time for enemy to aim around it ;p

Tier 8 will hold on against lower tiers, but not tier 8+ and/or goldspam.

Not even close to mighty T32.

AND ITS BIG AND FLAT.



SlappedbyRommel #6 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:43

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So is it even worth going down the heavy line based on first glance?

teamoldmill #7 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:54

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:43, said:

So is it even worth going down the heavy line based on first glance?

 

As an old timer, trying to ask myself why would play any of them over current tanks. Can't see any reason?  Seems like other tanks do things better at every tier. Auto loading may make the difference I suppose.


Edited by teamoldmill, Jan 05 2021 - 20:57.


HejHejMonika #8 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 20:56

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Jan 05 2021 - 14:43, said:

So is it even worth going down the heavy line based on first glance?

 

It's worth it for the sexy turret design of the tier ten alone.



PTwr #9 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:05

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:43, said:

So is it even worth going down the heavy line based on first glance?

Depends on how far you are in other lines, and what tiers are keepers for you. 

As it stands now, I think I'd rather go with Proggie or T57 than Rhino.

Its just another line in recent series of surprisingly balanced bunch of xp sinks. 

Seems like WG feels no reason anymore to make tier 10 temporarily OP to get peps to gold their way to it.

 

I'll grind it anyway, simply because I have nothing else to grind. 



grim_898 #10 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:12

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I won’t be getting them. Learned my lesson with the mediums. Not interested in having them nerfed to crap after I buy them

noupperlobeman #11 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:13

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After reading the thoughts here I have to wonder why you wouldn't just play the kranvagn. The stats on the 10 may change to attract more people to pay to get there

Zombie_Snuggles #12 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:20

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I’m enjoying the premium Bisonte C45 so I will grind them. I still have a ton of lines to grind but I’m excited for this one.

PTwr #13 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:22

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View Postnoupperlobeman, on Jan 05 2021 - 20:13, said:

After reading the thoughts here I have to wonder why you wouldn't just play the kranvagn. The stats on the 10 may change to attract more people to pay to get there

I think T57 is closer to Rhino. Both are mediumsh and Pattonish with a clip.

Kran, while small, is more of a gun emplacement with that impenetrable face of his. Rhino won't be tanking any shot with that overbite deformed face. 



aorticmojo #14 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:28

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I honestly see them getting a buff in the future.   They have been "nerfed" massively during super test, tier X was looking to be a DPM monster before many changes, and now their just meh.  I'll personally pick them up because they promote a more methodic playstyle which I actually enjoy.  I've loved the Bisonte and minus the crap turrets they seem to have I feel I'll like these too.  Minus the tier 7.

ThaneTyrian #15 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:32

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I'll get them.  I'm a collector.  Plus Auto-Loaders are my favorite thing to play.  Heavy Auto-Loaders first, Mediums next, Lights after that, TDs last.  I only have 3 lines left to get before they add new ones.  I'm actually MORE excited for the Italian Heavy Line and the Czech Heavy Line than I am for what I currently have left - German Light, Polish Medium, Japanese Heavy.  Well, I AM excited to get the Polish Medium - that's what I'm using my Chucky bonuses for :-)  Thanks OP for the Screen shots! 

aorticmojo #16 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 21:35

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View PostPTwr, on Jan 05 2021 - 19:11, said:

Bla bla, not final, bla bla, can change without notice etc.

 

TLDR: fat, clusmy, copy of MT line. More alpha in trade for mobility.

 

XP costs:

Tier 7: 57750 tank + 9500 + 12000 + 12500 + 20000 in modules (free radio from lower tiers)

Tier 8: 87200 tank + 17000 + 27000 + 7300 + 16000 + 25000 in modules

Tier 9: 150190 tank + 25000 + 27300 + 47000 + 9400 + 25000 + 55000 + 62000

Tier 10: 209860 tank

Total: 873500xp, 621000xp if you skip tiers.

 

As predicted its a line built of xp sinks, designed to goad you to skip tiers with power of gold. Disgustingly long stock grind, xp hidden in weak upgrades, tier 9 top gun designed for gold spam, etc etc.

All you get from fully researched MT's is a dinky radio on tier 7.

 

All of them can mount everything without upgrading tracks, but you might have problem fitting in equipment.

 

 

 

Tech tree:

Spoiler

 

Tier 6, P43 bis. Starting point.

Spoiler

 

Tier 7 Carro d'assalto P.88

Midtier trash designed to frustrate you into skipping tiers. Basically P43 with German 88's somehow fitted into that tiny turret. No autoloader.

Look at that sweet 0.42 base dispersion. Woohooo.

Spoiler

 

Tier 8 Progetto CC55 mod. 54

Thats a Patton-style hull with Pattonish turret on top. So original. Seems like Cold War tonks starts here.

Upgraded turret gets impressive looking mantlet. 100mm @ 45 angle... which is just dinky ~140mm so no hull down for you anyway.

Good sides? Good stock gun, but not much of an upgrade later on.

Seems like WG want's us to play tier 8, to observe how much better premium tanks are ;]

Spoiler

 

Tier 9 Progetto C50 mod. 66

What is that stock turret supposed to be?! Return of ARL-44 The Barn?

Continuing with Pattonish hull, this time twice the flat surfaces for artillery to land on, you get something that tries to be hull-down but forgot turret armor in garage.

Designed to make skipping economically viable choice (seriously, just throw blueprint and freexp turret+gun if you want tier 10). You can "quickly" reach gun upgrade for 55k... or just add 32k more for top gun.

But wait! Top gun is derpier, has worse AP pen, has only 22mm more gold pen, and gold is HEAT, and clip is smaller. is 80 (25%) more alpha worth it? Ehh... I got mixed feelings.

And that 74k xp in engines... ugh.

Spoiler

 

Tier 10 Rhinoceronte

Its not French-style oscillating turret. Its Sweedish type, like in Emils or UDES MT's.

Again Patton hull. Again no face armor. But this time face is so much in rear that it might be not visible in hulldown.

Spoiler

 

Quick question.  I notice on the Tier X the commanders hatch appears to be at the turret base and not on top.  Is that a weak spot?  Not on Tanks.GG yet and it seems like very strange placement.



PTwr #17 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 22:06

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View Postaorticmojo, on Jan 05 2021 - 20:35, said:

Quick question.  I notice on the Tier X the commanders hatch appears to be at the turret base and not on top.  Is that a weak spot?  Not on Tanks.GG yet and it seems like very strange placement.

Whole turret is a weakspot. Going by how simplified armor models got recently in terms of weakspots, hatches will probably count as flat. 

If you can hit those hatches, you might as well just hit those flaty cheeks.

190mm at slight angle? At best 250 effective I guess. Adding enough horizontal angle to make it bounce will just expose sides.

And don't forget that hull pretty much got no armor. 



pyantoryng #18 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 22:08

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The reload rate seem heavily nerfed for their calibers (That's VK100 12.8cm level of slow for a 105mm gun, 12.8cm reload for 120mm damage in tier 9, and derp gun slow for 12.8cm firepower for the tier 10). How would the "improved autoreloading system" going to affect it...Also, what are the upgraded turrets' impact on gun performance and magazine size (like, the Pantera getting a third round for its upgraded turret)?

 

...I do better in heavies than mediums anyway so I guess I'd give them a go in any case...they certainly do not look promising at the first glance though.

 



heavymetal1967 #19 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 22:26

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Plus one OP and following the thread as usual.

 

Well I'm currently sitting on enough xp on the six to unlock the seven.  So I will unlock it.  And this is the only line I have to research after I bought the CS-53 with Chuck's discount and researched the ten.

 

I also currently have 90 Italian prints and nothing else to use universals on, so I'll do the math (working backwards probably) and go from there.

 

I'm actually sitting on enough free xp, but won't use it to free xp the line.  Modules yes, but I'll use blueprints and grind the rest most likely.

 

Partly out of there's no other lines for me to grind and partly out of returning the ole one finger salute. 

 

Let 'em plug the xp sink drain with that.  :P

 

Plus it'll give me time to grind crews till crew 2.0 comes along and does a Deliverance themed Ned Beatty on us.  Credit to Tod for that imagery. 

 

As well as let other folks figure out the ins and out and what not of the line.

 

 



ThePigSheFlies #20 Posted Jan 05 2021 - 22:31

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Jan 05 2021 - 14:43, said:

So is it even worth going down the heavy line based on first glance?

 

in the 3 battles I saw on common test, not a one had a italian at top damage, or top xp.  yeah, very small sample size but this thing seems too situational to me.  I do admit that the gun looks neat at max depression like the RHM Pznerwagon's but I don't see this thing replacing many chieftains in clanwars due in large part to the lowish effective dpm.

 

in randoms it will at times shine vs pubbies that can't or refuse to push it, and for those that have the resources and already have every single other tank, there will be some early adopters that will make lesser skilled players not able to figure out how to handle it easily.

 

I can't help but wonder if they keep making these crew size switches at tier 10 to help make the player base get behind crew 2.0...






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