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killerman1997 #21 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 22:47

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View PostAltwar, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:11, said:

 

Yes, actually questioning that.   You are alleging that new players were pushed away.   Prove it.  All 100% as you term it here.

And your sister-in-law's baby cousin Tracy doesn't count.

Just because you say it's so does not mean it's so; it's a common allegation made by players on the forum when find a game mechanic, event, change distasteful.

There is no way to prove anything in WOT then, we have no way to figure it out. You a dont know if they dont either. What i can tell you, is i never want to play a game with a lefh in it. Or do i like playing tier 5 anymore.

Why are you being so defensive on this.

Just because you have a common allegation made by players on the forum that arty doesnt make people leave the game doesnt mean its so either. WE DONT KNOW THE TRUTH AND NEVER WILL.

 

all i can do is personally relate to the game and say, i would not play this game if i was stuck at tier 6 and below. I would be gone.



killerman1997 #22 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 22:51

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View Postblack_colt, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:31, said:

 

Agreed - facts require documentation - opinions and observations do not. 

 

Facts require documentation except we will never get any documentation other than what we observe.

My Opinion is valid here. So is this colts. as we cant ever figure it out.

 

I would not play this game if i was tier 6 and below. Lucky i have higher tiers to play. that is the only "proof" we will ever get. because how the hell can you tell otherwise?



killerman1997 #23 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 22:55

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View Postblack_colt, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:27, said:

 

What about the Tier VI M44 as well?

Does the M44 have faster than track repair ROF?, 390 base view range, 3000 DPM or the HEAT/AP that no other arty has (for balancing reasons [according to WG])



killerman1997 #24 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 22:56

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All of you can defend the Lefh all you want, i am not talking about other arty, im fine with those. THE LEFH is a little to good and its fighting new players... Thats what im saying, and i will always say that.

Altwar #25 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 23:01

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View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 13:47, said:

There is no way to prove anything in WOT then, we have no way to figure it out. You a dont know if they dont either. What i can tell you, is i never want to play a game with a lefh in it. Or do i like playing tier 5 anymore.

Why are you being so defensive on this.

Just because you have a common allegation made by players on the forum that arty doesnt make people leave the game doesnt mean its so either. WE DONT KNOW THE TRUTH AND NEVER WILL.

 

all i can do is personally relate to the game and say, i would not play this game if i was stuck at tier 6 and below. I would be gone.

 

There is no defensiveness here. That's you projecting an assumption on me.

You are asserting something by saying the leFH pushes away new players 100%.  I'm asking you to prove what you say or it's nothing but empty conjecture on your part.

As you admitted you can not prove it, it's safe to assume what you've said is the aforementioned empty conjecture.

 

I'm not saying the leFH doesn't or does chase players away.   I have no idea if it does and that wasn't the point.  The point was you said it did and you can't prove it.

it amounts to empty words on your part.

 

Btw, I've played on those tiers as well and in greater numbers.  leFH is no more different than any other vehicle.  Recognize it's on the battlefield and plan accordingly.  If a player doesn't know about the leFH and sits out in the open (clearly a bad practice) and gets hit from a few shots in a row, it may become clear to them that the next time they see one, they have to react.  No different than seeing a KV-2 on the field and being the unlucky player who is one shot.  Hey, maybe next time don't present one's self as a target.    leFH in the game?  Maybe moving around and making oneself a less desirable target is something to do.  The leFH is now available for sale?  Maybe pick one up, play it, understand what it can and can't do and now that player is better for it.  ;)



Casual_Boops #26 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 23:11

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Feb 25 2021 - 14:26, said:


Thanks for the CC clarification and I do hope WG and others do make an appearance after all information is taken then respond to the player base. If this is not handled correctly it will be dumpster burn.


Just because they don't comment doesn't mean they're not here, reading.

 

View Postblack_colt, on Feb 25 2021 - 15:27, said:

 

What about the Tier VI M44 as well?

 

Has needed to be hit with a nerf bat, hard, for at least 4 years.



killerman1997 #27 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 23:20

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View PostKiltedAmerican, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:22, said:

 

BALONEY 

 

View Postblack_colt, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:27, said:

 

What about the Tier VI M44 as well?

 

View Postblack_colt, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:31, said:

 

Agreed - facts require documentation - opinions and observations do not. 

 

 

View PostAltwar, on Feb 25 2021 - 14:27, said:

 

Can you show us the evidence of players being pushed away by the leFH?

 

For me, this is a fun vehicle that can also be frustrating at times.  It'll fire quickly, has no stun and can be an annoyance to heavy tanks and brutal to open top TDs.  But there's plenty of times where it can't hit an Amazon warehouse, let alone a barn and that ammo count can burn away quickly if a player doesn't watch it.

 

 

Let me show you some evidence of how good it is. Out of 63 arty in world of tanks

 

 

It is 1st for WN8, Only one other arty comes close, the rest are over 300 WN8 lower at best. most are over 600 WN8 lower.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in winrate

Spoiler

 

It is 18th for its Damage Per Game. Comparable to tier 8 arty.

Spoiler

its 1st for Kills per game. 25% more kills per game than the NEXT CLOSEST ARTY, Which is also Killing the low tier player base.

Spoiler

it is 10th for its Damage done to damage received.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in Kills/Death ratio by over 30% more than the next closest arty.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in survival rate by 2% to the next closest arty

Spoiler

 

It is 6th for Spots per game

Spoiler

 

 

Now Tell me again how this would not make people not leave? It is clearly overpowered. It clearly says this game can be Pay to Win.

 

Its worst Statistic is still better than 72% of the arty in the game.


Edited by killerman1997, Feb 25 2021 - 23:42.


killerman1997 #28 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 23:26

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View PostAltwar, on Feb 25 2021 - 17:01, said:

 

There is no defensiveness here. That's you projecting an assumption on me.

You are asserting something by saying the leFH pushes away new players 100%.  I'm asking you to prove what you say or it's nothing but empty conjecture on your part.

As you admitted you can not prove it, it's safe to assume what you've said is the aforementioned empty conjecture.

 

I'm not saying the leFH doesn't or does chase players away.   I have no idea if it does and that wasn't the point.  The point was you said it did and you can't prove it.

it amounts to empty words on your part.

 

Btw, I've played on those tiers as well and in greater numbers.  leFH is no more different than any other vehicle.  Recognize it's on the battlefield and plan accordingly.  If a player doesn't know about the leFH and sits out in the open (clearly a bad practice) and gets hit from a few shots in a row, it may become clear to them that the next time they see one, they have to react.  No different than seeing a KV-2 on the field and being the unlucky player who is one shot.  Hey, maybe next time don't present one's self as a target.    leFH in the game?  Maybe moving around and making oneself a less desirable target is something to do.  The leFH is now available for sale?  Maybe pick one up, play it, understand what it can and can't do and now that player is better for it.  ;)

i have one, from loot boxes and i will never play it. Because i want to keep people in this game. maybe you dont care about that, but i do.

 

So your idea for overpowered tanks is to change the entire meta of the game to hide behind rocks the entire game rather than nerf a OP tank?

 

KV-2 is strong, but when it shoots, you have 25 seconds to kill it. What happens when the lefh shoots? oh its not spotted and reloads in 7 seconds.


Edited by killerman1997, Feb 25 2021 - 23:31.


heavymetal1967 #29 Posted Feb 25 2021 - 23:28

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View PostKiltedAmerican, on Feb 25 2021 - 16:22, said:

 

BALONEY 

 

Spoiler
 

 



Cowcat137 #30 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 01:39

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Just because they don't comment doesn't mean they're not here, reading.

 

 

 

 



killerman1997 #31 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 03:20

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View PostCowcat137, on Feb 25 2021 - 19:39, said:

Just because they don't comment doesn't mean they're not here, reading.

I honestly hope so, because they just lost this fight on the Lefh, and they know it.



KiltedAmerican #32 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 03:26

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View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 21:20, said:

I honestly hope so, because they just lost this fight on the Lefh, and they know it.

 

Pffffffffffffffffft .... :sceptic:



bake3020 #33 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 03:45

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The leaf blower doesn't push away new players as it is not that good.  What really pushes away new players is WG's attitude and lack of real true assistance to them as they begin their journey.  There's never been a real training program for beginners nor for on going training.  Both are essential to help instill the basics in every player but where are they?  No, the selling of a certain premium vehicle is not the reason people don't stay, it's lack of training, and everything else the WG is doing wrong to recruit and keep players.

killerman1997 #34 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 05:52

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View Postbake3020, on Feb 25 2021 - 21:45, said:

The leaf blower doesn't push away new players as it is not that good.  What really pushes away new players is WG's attitude and lack of real true assistance to them as they begin their journey.  There's never been a real training program for beginners nor for on going training.  Both are essential to help instill the basics in every player but where are they?  No, the selling of a certain premium vehicle is not the reason people don't stay, it's lack of training, and everything else the WG is doing wrong to recruit and keep players.

do none of the metrics i listed matter? that it wins more battles than any other arty? that it kills 25% more tanks than ANY other arty, tier 10 included? that it can compete with tier 7/8's with damage done per battle? All this at tier 5?

 

Its blatantly OP. there is no other way around it.


Edited by killerman1997, Feb 26 2021 - 05:54.


Altwar #35 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 07:23

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View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 14:26, said:

i have one, from loot boxes and i will never play it. Because i want to keep people in this game. maybe you dont care about that, but i do.

 

So your idea for overpowered tanks is to change the entire meta of the game to hide behind rocks the entire game rather than nerf a OP tank?

 

KV-2 is strong, but when it shoots, you have 25 seconds to kill it. What happens when the lefh shoots? oh its not spotted and reloads in 7 seconds.

 

You don't have to hide behind rocks.  Maybe you should actually play the leFH and learn a bit more about how it plays.

I see you fell off your statement that it chases players away 100%.  That's good.  Had you said it was just your opinion, I'd have not even countered.

 

Saying that maybe I don't want to keep players in the game though?  That's nonsense which you don't have to resort to.    You needn't project an assumption on me.   State your case, support it if you can and if it fails (it did), then so be it.

 

What happens when the leFH fires?  Most times, it's a miss and with no stun, a miss is a miss.  When it hits, that target gets an arrow indicator that tells them where the leFH is shooting from.  Because the leFH fires quickly, it's not likely to move.   Signal it's location to your team, maybe they can do something while you have the leFH's attention.   Meanwhile you do your best to use cover, concealment and maneuvering to mitigate it's impact on you and keep things moving.   Watch the leFH then have to move on to the next target, which for me was usually the infamous seal clubbing T67.  Good times when the tables are turned on them. :)



RamaLamaDingDong1 #36 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 20:13

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View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 21:18, said:

You are actually questioning that? or is that rhetorical.

 

The Lefh 100% pushes new players away. might be the faster than track repair ROF it has, might be the 390 base view range in arty, might be the 3000 DPM it has. or maybe its the ability to three shot all tier 4 and 5's. Might be the HEAT/AP that no other arty has.

 

But thats all guessing, and personal experience of playing tier 4, 5 and 6

He is asking because he knows an so does anyone else that you have nothing to backup your statement besides your opinion.

There is a long list of items in WoT that people claim is the reason for a population decline an no new players entering the game. They normally skip its 11 year old game that has thrived financially an in popularity which is a normal process for a game that old..



RamaLamaDingDong1 #37 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 20:17

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View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 23:20, said:

 

 

 

 

 

Let me show you some evidence of how good it is. Out of 63 arty in world of tanks

 

 

It is 1st for WN8, Only one other arty comes close, the rest are over 300 WN8 lower at best. most are over 600 WN8 lower.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in winrate

Spoiler

 

It is 18th for its Damage Per Game. Comparable to tier 8 arty.

Spoiler

its 1st for Kills per game. 25% more kills per game than the NEXT CLOSEST ARTY, Which is also Killing the low tier player base.

Spoiler

it is 10th for its Damage done to damage received.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in Kills/Death ratio by over 30% more than the next closest arty.

Spoiler

 

It is 1st in survival rate by 2% to the next closest arty

Spoiler

 

It is 6th for Spots per game

Spoiler

 

 

Now Tell me again how this would not make people not leave? It is clearly overpowered. It clearly says this game can be Pay to Win.

 

Its worst Statistic is still better than 72% of the arty in the game.

Which can be said about most top tanks in any class which is why they are on top. I would rather face one than a M-44 but neither has made me at any point want to quit the game or not play tiers they appear in when i feel like dropping down.


Edited by RamaLamaDingDong1, Feb 26 2021 - 20:25.


killerman1997 #38 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 20:55

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View PostRamaLamaDingDong1, on Feb 26 2021 - 14:17, said:

Which can be said about most top tanks in any class which is why they are on top. I would rather face one than a M-44 but neither has made me at any point want to quit the game or not play tiers they appear in when i feel like dropping down.

So being number 1 in most metrics means its just good? if i got 25% more kills than the next best player, id be suspected of cheating. there is something called balance and maybe you should look into it, being the best tank is different than being better than tanks 3+ tiers above it.



killerman1997 #39 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 21:05

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View PostAltwar, on Feb 26 2021 - 01:23, said:

 

You don't have to hide behind rocks.  Maybe you should actually play the leFH and learn a bit more about how it plays.

I see you fell off your statement that it chases players away 100%.  That's good.  Had you said it was just your opinion, I'd have not even countered.

 

Saying that maybe I don't want to keep players in the game though?  That's nonsense which you don't have to resort to.    You needn't project an assumption on me.   State your case, support it if you can and if it fails (it did), then so be it.

 

What happens when the leFH fires?  Most times, it's a miss and with no stun, a miss is a miss.  When it hits, that target gets an arrow indicator that tells them where the leFH is shooting from.  Because the leFH fires quickly, it's not likely to move.   Signal it's location to your team, maybe they can do something while you have the leFH's attention.   Meanwhile you do your best to use cover, concealment and maneuvering to mitigate it's impact on you and keep things moving.   Watch the leFH then have to move on to the next target, which for me was usually the infamous seal clubbing T67.  Good times when the tables are turned on them. :)

Holy cow you are stuck on one thing i said, ill say it again for  your pleasure. The LeFH arty is clearly PAY TO WIN, and at some point, has drove people away form the game, weather it be one person, or 50% of the new player base i dont know. you can not sit here and say that not a single person left, nor can i say 50%, im saying THERE ARE SOME AMOUNT OF PEOPLE LEAVING BECAUSE OF IT. 100% sure of it. and if you honestly think other wise, there is no hope for you.

 

Now. You can say the same thing about any other arty. that they miss, or about any tank., that they miss. Yet some how THE LEFH HAS THE HIGHEST WIN RATE OUT OF ALL ARTY. BY 2 PERCENT.

 

If i had 2% more wins, id be in the top 99.9% of players. Id take that 2% and cherish it!

 

Now, please i want you to think about this, why dont you go play a non arty tank? im sure there some out there for you to play, i know it might be hard. But let me tell you about games being "Fun" and attracting more players.

 

Does winning a battle that you died in the first 2 mins by a tank you never saw make you have fun? NO. ITS THE FIGHTING TANKS THAT MAKES IT FUN. you are just shooting holes in your boat man. getting hit by an invisible tank is never fun, no way to counter it except to hide. Do you have fun hiding? maybe. i dont, i want to win and push up to kill tanks, to take map control, to have a brawl with a heavy. to angle my armor and bounce shots. Please tell me who would have fun hiding and cowering from arty?

 

 



KRZYBooP #40 Posted Feb 26 2021 - 21:12

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View PostSlappedbyRommel, on Feb 25 2021 - 12:44, said:

Krazyboop  I would really like to know why all you CC's are so silent on the Crew 2.0 with all the discussions going on in the forums? Is there a gun to all your heads from WG?

 

I haven't had the chance to dive into the sandbox, but all of us share our player's concerns with the cons of the changes. Remember these aren't 100% going into the game right yet. Your Community team is asking all the same questions that are being brought up and trying to find easy solutions. 

My opinion in the situation is that our Devs want to break the constant only one logical choice for our player's as you saw with equipment 2.0. 10 years of having all crew with the same set of skills some of which affect things that you don't really notice. Smooth ride? Off-road driving?! Isn't it a tank that does everything off-road? Who would put someone in the driver's seat and then tell them to pull over to swap out for someone that has off-road training? 

Our job isn't to sell the changes to players, or argue and debate. We are here to share the voice of our players, keep forums and other topics game-related. Yes, you caught me I am an advocate of optimism and try to light up some good in the changes that are proposed in some forum posts. Maybe even try to dispel some specific hat-wearing players, but that is just who I am as a person. 

 

View Postkillerman1997, on Feb 25 2021 - 12:46, said:

Please stop selling the 105 leFH18B2

 

You have done a Arty nerf but left the 105 leFH18B2 un nerfed and still sell it.

 

This tank pushes away so many new players. It is a toxic relic of the past that should not only be nerfed, but never sold again.

 

It is my favorite tank. I am not that great at the game and some games in Arty having a good time helps with keeping me engaged. 
The tank's only saving grace is that it rapid fires.

New players have every opportunity to get this tank through our sales/ gift boxes. 

 

Yea it's top for damage but was that statistic from all time? As in what are the stats since after the Arty reworks. 
Lef bottom tier isn't that fun especially in a tier 7 battle when you are pinging players for 23 in HE damage and the "premium" round bounces 75%-99% of the time. For me, it's 99%. 

 

TLDR Lef doesn't deal damage in HE, it doesn't stun, and its ridiculously slow even for an arty. 
Only good thing is how far and how often it can shoot in specific maps that don't have buildings or mountains in the way. 

BTW there isn't winning or losing a debate. You have your ideas and opinions and I have mine. It can drive players away or when it's for sale attract new players to buy it and play. 

View PostKiltedAmerican, on Feb 25 2021 - 14:06, said:

Just when I say I've quit spending money on WOT, I see a "need" for three leaf-blowers ...

 

Three Lefs on one hand, and ScrewU 2.0 on the other ...

 

Hmmmm ...

Three Lefs sounds like a fun time for Wheeled/ Light tanks to go hunt down. 







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