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Y'all need to show the developers some respect

Crew Training Retraining Crew 2.0 Sandbox

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EzioAuditore1456 #61 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 20:18

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View Posticbrainy, on Mar 02 2021 - 16:06, said:

 

On the contrary, it is justified, and for two reasons:

 

One, if we do things in a overtly-soft manner, then we nor them won't be able to quantify, let alone have irrefutable evidence, the strength of our views on how we really feel about something.

 

Two, if Wargaming continues on its current course of giving people a hard time, knowingly or not, then they rightly deserve all the flak and our negative views towards them, as clear consequences.

 

gave KRZYboop a bollocking for wrongly telling us what we should and shouldn't be worried about, and he rightly deserved it because its not up to him or any other employee how we should react to something, because that is completely against the foundational principle of gather customer feedback. In all honesty, I don't think he or those at Minsk understands the gravity of how things really do look at-present.

 

If they want the environment to change in a positive manner, well, the ball is on their side of the court to make it happen; but, instead of serving aces, they have been making one egregious bad serve after another. Boy this is no deuce here...

 

You're remarkably mistaken. Absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing, justifies uncivilized behavior. If you think the changes suck, you say that they suck, that's not being uncivilized. Now, going ape[edited], name calling, wall texting, threatening and offending the developers ain't gonna send the message any better (much to the opposite, they might as well ignore your feedback at all and do it anyway just to spite you). If y'all can't give negative feedback without being major [edited], then you are the problem, not the developers.

 

The relationship between the developers and the players ain't gonna be improved by name-calling, if you want to be heard you should be polite and level headed, simple as that. Now, if some people ain't mature enough to be polite and incisive at the same time, maybe the internet isn't their place.

 

 



icbrainy #62 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 20:28

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Mar 02 2021 - 19:18, said:

You're remarkably mistaken. Absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing, justifies uncivilized behavior. If you think the changes suck, you say that they suck, that's not being uncivilized. Now, going ape[edited], name calling, wall texting, threatening and offending the developers ain't gonna send the message any better (much to the opposite, they might as well ignore your feedback at all and do it anyway just to spite you). If y'all can't give negative feedback without being major [edited], then you are the problem, not the developers.

 

The relationship between the developers and the players ain't gonna be improved by name-calling, if you want to be heard you should be polite and level headed, simple as that. Now, if some people ain't mature enough to be polite and incisive at the same time, maybe the internet isn't their place.

 

If I am not saying what I truly feel, then I am being unfaithful, untruthful and dishonest to the community as a whole.

 

And as originally and correctly pointed out by others, respect is earned, not commanded.

 

I have had my say on Crew 2.0, and I make no apology about my stance, my conduct, nor my choice of words towards a known threat that Wargaming is clearly determined to implement as it has done with WoT on Console. That's my final line for this thread.



EzioAuditore1456 #63 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 20:47

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View Posticbrainy, on Mar 02 2021 - 16:28, said:

 

If I am not saying what I truly feel, then I am being unfaithful, untruthful and dishonest to the community as a whole.

 

And as originally and correctly pointed out by others, respect is earned, not commanded.

 

I have had my say on Crew 2.0, and I make no apology about my stance, my conduct, nor my choice of words towards a known threat that Wargaming is clearly determined to implement as it has done with WoT on Console. That's my final line for this thread.

 

If you can't say what you truly feel in a polite manner, you're not mature enough to live in society. You're welcome.

 

PS: no one cares if you're not gonna face the truth in this thread anymore, and if your parents never taught you that respect is reciprocal, then don't expect me to teach you



Sgt__Guffy #64 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 21:05

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Mar 02 2021 - 13:18, said:

 

You're remarkably mistaken. Absolutely nothing, and I mean nothing, justifies uncivilized behavior. If you think the changes suck, you say that they suck, that's not being uncivilized. Now, going ape[edited], name calling, wall texting, threatening and offending the developers ain't gonna send the message any better (much to the opposite, they might as well ignore your feedback at all and do it anyway just to spite you). If y'all can't give negative feedback without being major [edited], then you are the problem, not the developers.

 

The relationship between the developers and the players ain't gonna be improved by name-calling, if you want to be heard you should be polite and level headed, simple as that. Now, if some people ain't mature enough to be polite and incisive at the same time, maybe the internet isn't their place.

 

 

 

:facepalm:

 

I find your self appointed role as the "Behavior Police" a little irritating and I think other posters do as well. You have embarked on the crusade in a game which has one of the most toxic environments I have ever come across. One of the reasons I disabled chat in game a long time ago.

 

There will be always players who rant and express their opinions forcibly. Some may express their opinions in such a way that might not equate with your intellectual level. That does not mean they are not entitled to their opinion and to express it in a way they think will get other posters attention. That is what a forum is for, so posters can express their opinion. Some remarks will be heated, some might even be offensive. WG has moderators to police forums and it is their job, not yours, to determine if a poster has breached WG forum rules. 

 

I believe a poster can report a post if they consider the content inappropriate. I suggest the OP uses it.

 

If you cannot stand the heat, then get the hell out of the kitchen, though having a thicker skin might help . 

 

 



EzioAuditore1456 #65 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 21:20

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View PostSgt__Guffy, on Mar 02 2021 - 17:05, said:

 

:facepalm:

 

I find your self appointed role as the "Behavior Police" a little irritating and I think other posters do as well. You have embarked on the crusade in a game which has one of the most toxic environments I have ever come across. One of the reasons I disabled chat in game a long time ago.

 

There will be always players who rant and express their opinions forcibly. Some may express their opinions in such a way that might not equate with your intellectual level. That does not mean they are not entitled to their opinion and to express it in a way they think will get other posters attention. That is what a forum is for, so posters can express their opinion. Some remarks will be heated, some might even be offensive. WG has moderators to police forums and it is their job, not yours, to determine if a poster has breached WG forum rules. 

 

I believe a poster can report a post if they consider the content inappropriate. I suggest the OP uses it.

 

If you cannot stand the heat, then get the hell out of the kitchen, though having a thicker skin might help . 

 

 

 

Excuse me, but you need to point out where I ever talked about forum rules. All I'm talking about is general behavior, regardless of whether they're being apes here in the forum or somewhere else, and even then I'm not policing anyone really since I'm just exposing the obvious.

 

I've had much worse back in the day, several years ago when I first joined the game. Now I'm just telling to their face what they're doing, I couldn't care less if they keep thinking they're allowed to behave like apes just because they spent muh money in the game. It's almost as if that doesn't give them the right to act like they do, like they own everything (and even if they did, they'd be the [edited]boss no one likes)



Waylandie #66 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 21:59

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Mar 02 2021 - 20:47, said:

 

If you can't say what you truly feel in a polite manner, you're not mature enough to live in society. You're welcome.

 

PS: no one cares if you're not gonna face the truth in this thread anymore, and if your parents never taught you that respect is reciprocal, then don't expect me to teach you

PS: Nobody cares about your idea of how people should act.  Sometimes a wall of text is needed, when you pointing out more then one issue.  I'm sorry that reading 4-5 paragraphs is hard for you because you attention span is three lines or less, that is your hang up, not ours.  I do find your complaint about a wall of text weird though, since your OP was one. 

With the exception of one post which was pretty much ignored, I haven't seen any developer threatened or cussed out in the forums.  In fact if you do that, you get banned pretty fast.  So other then in your imagination, I don't see where the problem is.  If the developers and others can't handle negative feedback from the player base then they should get a different job.  You seem to have this idea that because  you're older that everyone should do what you say, and if that is how you feel, I suggest you go back to leave it to beaver reruns and not interact with anyone in the modern world.



EzioAuditore1456 #67 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 22:37

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I think it's remarkably funny how some people are claiming I'm trying to impose an ideal of behavior, as if the internet is a no man's land (the ones that actually take that seriously are usually criminals). Like, seriously, it's almost as if there are certain kinds of behavior that are expected and tolerated in the real, mature, adult world. Almost.

KomodoDagger22 #68 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 22:56

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Feb 28 2021 - 15:21, said:

First things first, I barely ever browse the forums, let alone post in it.
 

I always love watching players who "don't post in forums" argue. Apparently they don't play the game either - less than 16k battles and he says we need to "respect the developers" - where was your respect while you "weren't" playing the game in 8 years? :trollface:


Edited by RemovedMy2Key, Mar 02 2021 - 22:56.


mphsmeister #69 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 23:06

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The system of 2.0 is broke and reduces your tanks abilities. It would be one thing if it was a even swap out but no, its a poorly thought out idea


Edited by mphsmeister, Mar 02 2021 - 23:06.


Waylandie #70 Posted Mar 02 2021 - 23:42

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Mar 02 2021 - 22:37, said:

I think it's remarkably funny how some people are claiming I'm trying to impose an ideal of behavior, as if the internet is a no man's land (the ones that actually take that seriously are usually criminals). Like, seriously, it's almost as if there are certain kinds of behavior that are expected and tolerated in the real, mature, adult world. Almost.

For someone that seems awfully focused on respect to others, you don't seem to have a problem throwing out names or implying someone's not an adult  



SawUcomin #71 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 01:13

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View PostCowcat137, on Mar 01 2021 - 03:22, said:

You gotta wonder what's the point of ranked battles when players can buy crew books, getting 17% advantages with cash.  (source:Quickybaby)

This is EXACTLY why War Shaming has made these changes!

There was no reason for it except to generate income for Wot!



Mac_1952 #72 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 03:15

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To me it is a foregone conclusion that Crew 2.0 will be implemented; there is a limited opportunity to make suggestions to make it more palatable.

 

I see no need for the change; I believe it will lead to cookie cutter crews, and new players will be at a bigger disadvantage.

 

I made several suggestions to 'improve' it.. doubt that any will be implemented.

 

 

 

guess I will just stock up on good single malt Scotch.

 

Slainte



M00seface #73 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 04:11

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Feb 28 2021 - 23:21, said:

First things first, I barely ever browse the forums, let alone post in it. The amount of toxicity in here is enough to keep me posted by third party sites, so don't expect me to be a recognizable face. Second, although I usually don't care about the forums or the people in it, I've been seeing the same pattern of behavior for long enough to drop some truths many of you won't like to hear, and the first one is this: you're being a bunch of [edited]towards the developers.
 
I won't write a sappy story about my history with this game or how meaningful it's been to my life, all you need to know is that I joined it, played it a lot, quit and came back some time ago. So yeah, instead of whining about how the game sucked, I stopped playing it and when I came back I deemed the game worthy enough of my time to keep playing it. How dare I do such a mature, reasonable thing, amirite? Well, anyway.
 
Allow me to say this in no uncertain terms: I love Crew 2.0. I love how it's being made so you'll have more choices, I love how it's being planned to allow more unique gameplay, and I certainly love the amount of simplicity and complexity put in a balanced mix that I haven't seen in a long time in this game. Now, I really do share several of your concerns about the current iteration of this system, particularly how you grind several crews for several lines and some of them are gonna become pretty much useless in those Nations with several lines of the same class, like having 5 different, high quality crews for all the 5 different Soviet heavies, or with completely different gameplay among the same class that wouldn't benefit from a shared crew, like the German destroyer lines. Thing is, that doesn't give y'all the right to behave like a bunch of apes.
 
Apparently, the sheer hate for the developers, regardless of how hard they've been trying to improve the game, listen to our demands and redesign core gameplay aspects, is enough to make you completely ignore the fact that this is simply a sandbox run, a testing ground, a mere indicator of something might or might not come. I can't help but think someone that doesn't understand the difference between the common test and the sandbox server is particularly stupid, but even then, if those changes were slated for the next patch, personally attacking and threatening the developers ain't the way to go.
 
Like, I'd really like to agree with someone that thinks the current iteration needs to be tweaked and further testing needs to be done (although this is definitely a step in the right direction), but nearly all I'm seeing is people being top grade [edited]because they don't like the change, as if they're incapable of expressing themselves without being absolute wankers, several of them complaining about spending countless hours and dollars into the game as if that gave them the exclusive right to pick the game's future (I started playing this game back when I couldn't afford buying a garage slot with gold, mind you), ignoring that for a large chunk of the players, including me, these changes are mostly positive. Yes, I also have several hours into the game and a rather good amount of money spent into it. Yes, I also have dozens of tanks in my garage and several crews with 3 or 4, even 5 skills. Yes, I also think that we should be given more points or a better conversion rate. Yes, I definitely think we should be able to convert unused crew members into XP regardless of level. No, I don't think sending death threats to the developers is alright.
 
So, instead of going bat[edited] over changes that ain't even here yet - although you do need to be rather dumb to believe they'd bother going through such a complete system rework and never implement it in any way - maybe, just maybe, you could be civilized humans beings and expose your disagreement with the current iteration of testing in a respectful, appropriate manner so the developers can focus on bettering the system and tweaking what's in need of some adjustments? Y'know, just saying.
 
PS: don't even bother thinking I'm gonna waste my time replying to your hateful rhetoric and disgraceful jokes, I'm just gonna take whatever money you think wargaming certainly must have given me and do something I actually enjoy doing instead of doing something I don't enjoy and constantly [edited]about it

What the hell is wrong with you? We all know its a sandbox, I certainly do not disrespect the developers and any informed player knows its not the developers responsible for these type of changes being implemented if indeed they are implemented. Developers offer the vision, the suits decide how to market it. So get off you high horse an except a difference of opinion. There is obviously going to be players out there like myself who adore this game so inevitably emotions will run high and they may disagree with you. Just like they may disagree with my reply. Learn to be tolerant to opinions that differ from your own. That does not make them a bad person, just different.

 

Salut.



EzioAuditore1456 #74 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 16:50

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View PostMac_1952, on Mar 02 2021 - 23:15, said:

To me it is a foregone conclusion that Crew 2.0 will be implemented; there is a limited opportunity to make suggestions to make it more palatable.

 

I see no need for the change; I believe it will lead to cookie cutter crews, and new players will be at a bigger disadvantage.

 

I made several suggestions to 'improve' it.. doubt that any will be implemented.

 

 

 

guess I will just stock up on good single malt Scotch.

 

Slainte

 

Unfortunately, many people are ignoring this window of opportunity to actually give suggestions and proper feedback. If they choose to implement this system, even with tweaked changes, those whiners will end up having wasted their opportunity to make things even better than what's probably gonna be implemented.



Waylandie #75 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 17:41

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Mar 03 2021 - 16:50, said:

 

Unfortunately, many people are ignoring this window of opportunity to actually give suggestions and proper feedback. If they choose to implement this system, even with tweaked changes, those whiners will end up having wasted their opportunity to make things even better than what's probably gonna be implemented.

Really what world are you living in?  Are you on or off your meds?  There are countless forum posts that give constructive criticism, there are CCs that have made videos talking about what should be tweaked.  The only person that thinks that isn't happening is you.  Between these imaginary posts where people are threatening the developers, and you not seeing all the posts about feedback and how to adjust it, I'm starting to think you work for WG and crew 2.0 was your idea.  Because your taking the threads personally.



BlaqWolf #76 Posted Mar 03 2021 - 19:16

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When they earn it, they'll get it.

Until then... don't think so.

Sl33pyAlligat0r #77 Posted Mar 04 2021 - 00:55

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View PostEzioAuditore1456, on Feb 28 2021 - 17:21, said:

First things first, I barely ever browse the forums, let alone post in it. The amount of toxicity in here is enough to keep me posted by third party sites, so don't expect me to be a recognizable face. Second, although I usually don't care about the forums or the people in it, I've been seeing the same pattern of behavior for long enough to drop some truths many of you won't like to hear, and the first one is this: you're being a bunch of [edited]towards the developers.
 
I won't write a sappy story about my history with this game or how meaningful it's been to my life, all you need to know is that I joined it, played it a lot, quit and came back some time ago. So yeah, instead of whining about how the game sucked, I stopped playing it and when I came back I deemed the game worthy enough of my time to keep playing it. How dare I do such a mature, reasonable thing, amirite? Well, anyway.
 
Allow me to say this in no uncertain terms: I love Crew 2.0. I love how it's being made so you'll have more choices, I love how it's being planned to allow more unique gameplay, and I certainly love the amount of simplicity and complexity put in a balanced mix that I haven't seen in a long time in this game. Now, I really do share several of your concerns about the current iteration of this system, particularly how you grind several crews for several lines and some of them are gonna become pretty much useless in those Nations with several lines of the same class, like having 5 different, high quality crews for all the 5 different Soviet heavies, or with completely different gameplay among the same class that wouldn't benefit from a shared crew, like the German destroyer lines. Thing is, that doesn't give y'all the right to behave like a bunch of apes.
 
Apparently, the sheer hate for the developers, regardless of how hard they've been trying to improve the game, listen to our demands and redesign core gameplay aspects, is enough to make you completely ignore the fact that this is simply a sandbox run, a testing ground, a mere indicator of something might or might not come. I can't help but think someone that doesn't understand the difference between the common test and the sandbox server is particularly stupid, but even then, if those changes were slated for the next patch, personally attacking and threatening the developers ain't the way to go.
 
Like, I'd really like to agree with someone that thinks the current iteration needs to be tweaked and further testing needs to be done (although this is definitely a step in the right direction), but nearly all I'm seeing is people being top grade [edited]because they don't like the change, as if they're incapable of expressing themselves without being absolute wankers, several of them complaining about spending countless hours and dollars into the game as if that gave them the exclusive right to pick the game's future (I started playing this game back when I couldn't afford buying a garage slot with gold, mind you), ignoring that for a large chunk of the players, including me, these changes are mostly positive. Yes, I also have several hours into the game and a rather good amount of money spent into it. Yes, I also have dozens of tanks in my garage and several crews with 3 or 4, even 5 skills. Yes, I also think that we should be given more points or a better conversion rate. Yes, I definitely think we should be able to convert unused crew members into XP regardless of level. No, I don't think sending death threats to the developers is alright.
 
So, instead of going bat[edited] over changes that ain't even here yet - although you do need to be rather dumb to believe they'd bother going through such a complete system rework and never implement it in any way - maybe, just maybe, you could be civilized humans beings and expose your disagreement with the current iteration of testing in a respectful, appropriate manner so the developers can focus on bettering the system and tweaking what's in need of some adjustments? Y'know, just saying.
 
PS: don't even bother thinking I'm gonna waste my time replying to your hateful rhetoric and disgraceful jokes, I'm just gonna take whatever money you think wargaming certainly must have given me and do something I actually enjoy doing instead of doing something I don't enjoy and constantly [edited]about it

 

If money were no issue, I might agree with you



WastedSpacer #78 Posted Mar 04 2021 - 02:57

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View Post_W_R_A_I_T_H_, on Mar 01 2021 - 01:56, said:

Aside from free sixth sense and being able to use one commander in 3 tanks, I HATE everything else about Crew 2.0. 

 

WG could easily add sixth sense to all commanders and be able to assign each crew member to 3 different tanks in the current system; therefore, Crew 2.0 is not needed. 

Alas - I don't even like a free 6th sense on all tanks just LTs - not having 6th sense forces newer (non LT) players to read the minimap and assess where team mates are vs enemies. If you knew ALL LTs had 6th sense then that would add a lot to encouraging folks to learn to play more as a team. I suggested this could be implemented as a permanent directive just for LTs all other classes have to choose to learn it or use a directive. 



Herr_Apotheker #79 Posted Mar 04 2021 - 04:39

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I'm entirely anti "Free 6th sense to all" in 2.0. 

 

What is the rationale? To lure new players in? Or to soothe the impact of massive 2.0 re-work?

 

1) It is apparent to this observer: Free 6th sense to all, and NO OTHER CHANGES of 2.0 will dramatically affect game-play. No doubt.

 

2) I believe, a limited tier I-V "spider sense" which might offer the newbies more chances to learn without being Seal Clubbed right to "not interested street" would not break the game...

 

3) Idea: "Spider Sense for Newbies" would work 100% for the first 500 battles at each tier, as a training tool, to teach timing, then, it should become necessary to grind it in the form of Conventional 6th Sense the way all us old-timers had to.

 

Apotheker



BlaqWolf #80 Posted Mar 04 2021 - 08:46

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The problem with 6th is that it's all but required for every vehicle.  Perhaps not heavies /as much/, but it's still one of the first three skills, often held over as the crew was brought up from other vehicles along the tech tree.

Most, myself included, see it as a waste of both time to train and $$$ to retrain it out (for super heavies that don't care if they've been spotted).  And even heavies rely heavily on it.

It's a requirement, almost as much as BiA, chewing up hundreds or thousands of games limiting other skills from being trained that will have more appreciable affects on player enjoyment.

The current iteration of 2.0, however, is a hot mess that needs drastic changes (which I pointed out in a thread I started).



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