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Penetration, bounce, ricochet


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Rumbaugh #121 Posted Feb 01 2011 - 02:57

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Was in an M6 (840hp) with a 76mm M1A2 gun. Used AP rounds w/ 96-160 penetration and 86-144 damage. Faced an M3 (310 hp) 50/38/38. fired 5 rounds at him from 50yrds to point blank. First round in side didn't kill him. 2nd round in side told me "bounced" 3rd round point blank in side didn't kill him. 4th round point blank to front then 5th point blank to front. He ended up killing me. At start I was about 75% he was 100% i believe. His shots were all to my front.

Otto_matic_Reiffel #122 Posted Feb 01 2011 - 04:04

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There's a thread in the German Heavy forum that shows that a Leichttraktor can penetrate and cause engine fires to a VK 4502 Ausf. B from the front using base gun with AP - http://forum.worldof...ltracktor-food/

SnakeTheFox #123 Posted Feb 01 2011 - 05:30

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JT mantlet is still bugged. I have no idea its true thickness bug I can guarantee from the looks of it that it adds at least another 50~mm onto the already thick 250mm when you factor in the heavy sloping. And yet I've had pretty much all tanks penetrate this area. Can't recall what hit me here, but judging from the visible players likely something that shouldn't have been able to. This isn't an isolated fluke, it happens all the time and I've had T-44's with 100mm D10T's penetrate it.

Guaranteed this is a duplicated bug report many hundreds of times over; but the developers NEED TO FIX THIS. It is unacceptable that it has gone without fixing for so long, and the release of the game looms so close that it's absolutely ridiculous that the developers haven't heeded the countless bug reports on this issue and yet tanks such as the Object and ISU-152 seem unaffected. I'm sure people hate hearing "Russian bias"; so fix it and we wont have to say it. Until then...

http://img33.imagesh...uggedashell.jpg

locopyro #124 Posted Feb 02 2011 - 05:15

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[EDIT] nothing for me to add, sorry

AtomicNeuron #125 Posted Feb 03 2011 - 01:52

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Recently in a sherman, w/ AP rounds (the composite ones w/ extra penetration). Avg penetration should be around 120 with the un-upgraded gun (no howitzer). Came up behind a T34-85 nailed it in the rear, for a ricochet... dead on shot, less than 2 meters at ~40mm of armor and I get a ricochet? really? He turns around and one shots me... sigh.

TStick #126 Posted Feb 03 2011 - 09:16

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Aaah, just lovely. Yesterday i got the S70 for my IS4. Very nice indeed, but i already encountered serveral of the crazy situations mentioned above:

Like today, spotted a fleeing su-8 @ 300 meters from my tank, while advancing towards him, he moved away to my right. Hit the brakes, closed the aim, and hit him full un the side: result, a Catchinnng ! sound, no damage. i pay 1.118 Credits for a shell like that FFS !

And that was not all, i've had like 10-15 of these low-tier target sideshot catchinggggggggg's the 3 days me and the s70 had together, total BS.

http://funny-stuff.3...329/fail_08.jpg

wombat_of_war #127 Posted Feb 03 2011 - 12:41

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I just upgraded my su-100 to a 122mm main gun 175 mm of penetration. i fired at a pzIII at 20 metres and the round bounced  :blink:

NachoFoot #128 Posted Feb 12 2011 - 19:14

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Testing of the gold ammo for the 152mm ML-20 note the same penetration as AP ammo but with less damage.  Post here:  152mm ML-20 Gold Ammo Bug

Crossfire_187th #129 Posted Feb 14 2011 - 04:55

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Hello

I am expressing some concerns about M6's 90mm gun. Today, I have noticed that 90mm has been bouncing off against the T29, T34-85, Jagdpanther and IS3 in three games (battles) in a row...

I don't use the sniper mode or 3D mode... Using the gunsight is better aiming at the weak armour or track. I cannot understand how or why the 90mm keeps bouncing lot than penetration.

For example, I was aiming the side of IS3 (90 degree angle) to disable his track in approx 100m or less. I fired 90mm AP and it bounced off. I fired again and it bounced off again. He exposed his rear armour to me for allowing my opportunity. I fired third round of AP. It bounced off... WTH? Same thing to Jagdpanther's side armour.

90mm states that it will pentrate the 160mm against IS3's armour -- Sides 90mm and rear 60mm... and Jagdpanther's armour -- Sides 50mm...

Please investigate this problem. It has been bouncing off more (guess around 80%) than pentration.

AtomicNeuron #130 Posted Feb 17 2011 - 05:15

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Out of curiosity how does an HE shell bounce? As another note in a grille with the upgraded gun I bounced a HE round of the side armor of a leopard at 50 meters. Honestly that shell should have blown the crap out of it considering it's rated for 700 with a penetration value close to 100.

Fodder84 #131 Posted Feb 17 2011 - 05:32

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I get that alot...my HE shells often 'bounce' which doesnt quite make sense...

I thought the whole idea of HE was it exploded on impact and thus should deal at least some damage.

Dr_Atomic #132 Posted Feb 18 2011 - 00:40

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No matter what tank i'm driving / using I constantly get bounces, or perfectly lined up side shots that do absolutly nothing.
Its really frustrating to get either a bounce or a shot that does nothing. It usually happens when i'm snipping,ie hidden.

It could be any combination of my tank thier tank and its always a facter of winning or loosing.

For the amount of shells that bounce or do nothing when I fire them are higher than when others score a bounce off of me!
I have to almost always use heat shells to penitrate tanks that are either Tier....because of the dagnabbit bounce/do nothing shot.

Another tid bit....is the amount of silver earned without a premium account isn't even close to repairing or re-supplying ammo
either from a win or defeat.

armygruntjoe #133 Posted Feb 18 2011 - 04:14

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I am in a Tiger I. I use the 88mm gun and cannot scratch a German 3601 at all, yet it consistantly kills me.....
When I was using the 3601, I couldn't hurt the Tiger....I keep coming across game glitches like that a lot. The only way I can hurt or kill the enemy is if i pay for the ACPR rounds using gold...which I am told I will have to pay for.

This game needs serious reconfigurations when it comes to the "game mechanics" due to the historically incorrect portrayal of battle conditions. As a WWII historical researcher, I do indeed know the realities of combat...say 4 M4A3 Shermans against a Tiger. Battle records show that a Sherman could only crack a Tiger from the rear, but the Americans were GUARANTEED to lose at least 2 of their 4 trying.

Some of these tanks were not actually used in WWII, such as the T-54. Russian tanks were named by Allied powers in the first year they were produced, hence the T-54 started production in 1954. The US "T" series that is in this game are grossly over-stacked.

The anti-tank (AT) units that you call "tank destroyers" have a monstrous problem. They never show up when they fire, which is totally and completely unrealistic. Basically, you are giving them a cloaking device and letting them fire with it. FACT: AT units in WWII sent out a larger flash and smoke plume than normal tanks. This made them easier to spot.

A lot of players are complaining about these things and many have said they will stop playing once they have to pay for anything because of the massive unfair advantage that AT units have.

Read up on your history, gentlemen. Please at least give these notes some consideration.

Thank you for your time.

SPC Joseph E. Price
"armygruntjoe"

P.S. - By the way, your artillery units are spot on perfect. Do NOT change them at all.

RingoMcHarrison #134 Posted Feb 20 2011 - 05:11

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Wargaming never ceases to surprise me.

Five minutes ago in Pagorki. I'm on my tiger, around 60% health, a fair balanced match, two or three tanks and one arty remaining per side.

Rush the enemy base looking for the enemy hummel. As usual, I paseed 100m away and couldn't spot him til he fired (but we've accepted that kind of crap already). He hits me, 30% health gone, 30% remaining.

No problem, shot him on the run, hit, half his health gone. Looking good so far, I'll reload faster for sure, so I keep driving straight to him and stop to take the final shot.

DING! THAT ONE BOUNCED! What? With the long 88? On a SPG? Was so wtf at the moment that the Hummel turns and proceeds to nuke me.

After the initial shock I go back to the garage to check Hummel stats, maybe its heavily armored or something, but then I see "armor up to 30 mm"  :(

Not funny.

AtomicNeuron #135 Posted Feb 21 2011 - 04:38

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Sigh, yet another one, though this time with a photo (upon request have it sitting on my desktop w/ the nice neat hole I made in the VK). KV w/ the 107, critical hit to smack dab front of a VK 3601 w/ no damage... range <10 meters. Maybe I am misunderstanding how critical hits work, I would assume it would at least do some damage if penetration occurs, and it's clearly not passing through the tank into the ground, that shot should have blown the crap out of the VK.

Sickocrow #136 Posted Mar 01 2011 - 02:41

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100% VK3601H was 'one shotted' by a IS-3.   No Arty or allied fired.  No ammo explosion.  Got hit in the front Glacius armor and boom.

Trecares #137 Posted Mar 07 2011 - 20:54

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Please see attached screenshot. This shot managed to damage my tank despite only going through the track cover. The trajectory would have passed through the track and out beyond. So there's no way it should have done any damage to the tank. Tracking, ok fine, but in this case, I didn't get tracked.

Crossfire_187th #138 Posted Mar 08 2011 - 06:53

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I like to report a bug in one of recently battle...

I was in Churchill MKIV or MKIII with 6 pdr MKV engaging the T29 heavy tank... I was in flanking position and swinging around to get behind of T29 where the weak rear-armour, 51mm, was...  We were apart about 20 yards as point-blank range.  I fired both AP and APC (110mm/180mm) to penetrate his rear armour in quick firing. I noticed that both AP and APC were bounced off and not doing any damage score. Please investigate this matter...  I strongly suggest increasing the damage score rather than 75 points for 6 pdr MKIII and MKV.

Trecares #139 Posted Mar 09 2011 - 08:32

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Ok, I got hit by a JadgTiger on the side of the turret. It left a long groove, but no visible penetration. Yet, I still took damage from the shot. It appears to be a glancing shot, so it should have bounced off without causing any damage. This was the only shot that I received.

If you want the screenshot, do something about the attachment limits. "Used xxxxxK of your 500K global upload quota (Max. single file size: 73.6K)" Bit silly to impose such a low limit, especially when your screenshots aren't even that small. Also, hard drive space is fairly cheap.

Crossfire_187th #140 Posted Mar 16 2011 - 07:52

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Hello again

I am expressing my concerns about lacking of Penetration. I was in Sherman E8 with fully upgrade equipments, 90% AP shells were bounce-off against Tier 6 - 9... Also, 6pdr was worst bounce-off AP and APC against Tier 4 - 8 than ricohet... HE were fine, but AP were not... Please investigate this matter.

Update:(6:16p.m. EST)
I was in in fully-upgraded Sherman E8 and recently engaged the KV-3 with upgraded turret. In med-range, two AP rounds were penetrated and scored reducing the armour strenght, but in point blank range, 100% AP rounds (not APC) were bounced off the side and rear armoured hulls (90mm and 75mm) and no reduced-score. I could not understand why AP M79 should penetrate between 96mm and 160mm in order to reduce the armour strength between 84 and 144 damage points. I did not use the sniper or 3D mode...

Please investigate this matter too...




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