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Penetration, bounce, ricochet


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Fredziosz #41 Posted Oct 18 2010 - 00:18

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Tbh, now i had 2 richochets from 50mm armor and another 2 from 30mm side armor (while hitting it at 90 degrees) with 88 L56 gun which has minimal 92mm penetration...

Even better JagdPanther had ricochet from my Stug 30mm side armor (while hitting me at 90 degrees) with its 88 L71 gun...


Something's wrong with this picture...
There's something to be done about this.

killakanz #42 Posted Oct 19 2010 - 18:27

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Just fired at an SU-14 at the front with IS 122mm HE from some 400m, "didn't even scratch them".
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but SU-14 has 50mm front armor, my HE penetrates 43-79mm before unleashing upto 605 damage. That should very much scratch them.

zmeul #43 Posted Oct 20 2010 - 12:27

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View Postkillakanz, on Oct 19 2010 - 18:27, said:

Just fired at an SU-14 at the front with IS 122mm HE from some 400m, "didn't even scratch them".
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but SU-14 has 50mm front armor, my HE penetrates 43-79mm before unleashing upto 605 damage. That should very much scratch them.
because of the randomness factor it's posible that your shell wated to penetrate from 43mm to 49mm and not beyond that
it's not imposible since you say it has 50mm frontal armor

TigerHawk #44 Posted Oct 28 2010 - 07:42

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What I hate is getting penetrating shots(into the hull, not the tracks and then into the ground) that do 0 damage.

Today I fired two 88mm shots into the front of a PzIII/IV at 6%, AP rounds, both said "critical hit" from my crew, and did no damage whatsoever. I was even zoomed in and saw the penetration holes on his hull, so it wasn't a ricochet glitch that announced wrong or something.

Then later I fired five shots into the side of an IS, all penetrated but 1(did track damage) but after that one I zoomed in carefully and aimed between the hull and turret making SURE there could be no "through the tracks and into the ground" excuse. One was critical hit. Again, 0% damage. Again I zoomed in and saw penetration holes on the side I'd been firing at, and I was the only one shooting at him from this angle.

The devs are already aware of this bug, but I wish instead of packing 10000000000000000000000 fixes into 0.6 they would just release a hotfix for stuff like this. It gets really aggrivating, especially now that they've nerfed the exp/credit rewards. I didn't get a single recognition for all those 0% damage shots as at the end screen it said all I'd done was scout and gave me a measely 98 exp in a VK3001P.

You know if you pack too many fixes/changes into one patch it's just gonna make more work for you when something inevitably goes wrong because you tried to do/update/change too many things at once and you'll have a hard time tracking down exactly what went wrong and where. But I guess we're just going to have to live with these aggrivating issues for another month until the US tank patch rolls out.

Yes yes beta I know I don't expect bug-free gameplay or even the great stability we've had so far but issues like these shouldn't really have to wait 3-4 weeks for a fix. Battles are won and lost because of this one. Should be a priority.

MrCaffeLatte #45 Posted Oct 28 2010 - 18:41

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View PostTigerHawk, on Oct 28 2010 - 07:42, said:

What I hate is getting penetrating shots(into the hull, not the tracks and then into the ground) that do 0 damage.

Today I fired two 88mm shots into the front of a PzIII/IV at 6%, AP rounds, both said "critical hit" from my crew, and did no damage whatsoever. I was even zoomed in and saw the penetration holes on his hull, so it wasn't a ricochet glitch that announced wrong or something.

Then later I fired five shots into the side of an IS, all penetrated but 1(did track damage) but after that one I zoomed in carefully and aimed between the hull and turret making SURE there could be no "through the tracks and into the ground" excuse. One was critical hit. Again, 0% damage. Again I zoomed in and saw penetration holes on the side I'd been firing at, and I was the only one shooting at him from this angle.

The devs are already aware of this bug, but I wish instead of packing 10000000000000000000000 fixes into 0.6 they would just release a hotfix for stuff like this. It gets really aggrivating, especially now that they've nerfed the exp/credit rewards. I didn't get a single recognition for all those 0% damage shots as at the end screen it said all I'd done was scout and gave me a measely 98 exp in a VK3001P.

You know if you pack too many fixes/changes into one patch it's just gonna make more work for you when something inevitably goes wrong because you tried to do/update/change too many things at once and you'll have a hard time tracking down exactly what went wrong and where. But I guess we're just going to have to live with these aggrivating issues for another month until the US tank patch rolls out.

Yes yes beta I know I don't expect bug-free gameplay or even the great stability we've had so far but issues like these shouldn't really have to wait 3-4 weeks for a fix. Battles are won and lost because of this one. Should be a priority.


I couldn't agree more. Releasing a bunch of fixes in a 'pack' isn't going to make anyone more appreciative, only more annoyed that they weren't released as soon as they could have been... Unless this is one of the last things to be worked on, which it shouldn't.

BigDov #46 Posted Oct 29 2010 - 17:00

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Had this happened twice with different guns but both shooting the same tank - IS-4, First gun was the 7.5cm KwK41 L/58 conical firing AP ammo, shot the tank 7 times in various points(Tracks, External fuel tanks, gun) all shots penetrated but did no damage, some were even critical hits and I did de-track it, However the end-of-match report showed that I hadn't been rewarded for tracking him nor getting any hits as he the tank wasn't listed as damaged by me.

Second gun was the Gun 7.5cm KwK42 L/70 again AP ammo, shot the tracks multiple times, hearing "We hit them hard", "Critical hit" etc, but again failed to show any damage, and again the match report showed no is-4 as being damaged by me.

If its of any significance both guns were fitted to a VK3601(H) with crews @ 76%+.

Edit: Just happened again shot an IS-4, got the " We hit them hard" no damage, and no listed damage on the post match report, the common factor for me seems to be the IS-4, seems to be the only tank I get the penetration and no-damage, at least with the 75mm weapons on the VK3601, will have to wait and see what the results are like with the 88mm.

TigerHawk #47 Posted Oct 30 2010 - 11:38

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Okay, seriously. I just had a round in my fully upgraded 3001P where I had 10 shots total hit a KV-3, a T-43, a Jpanther, and an IS4 all from the side(not tracks) or behind, penetrate, and do 0 damage. After all that, I died.

Guess what? Because of that freaking bug I got 87 exp and 4k credits for my effort because none of the hits registered on the scoreboard because of 0 damage being done. Meanwhile I spent 3k in ammo alone, now add in my repair bill(7k) and I just made negative a ton of credits because they won't release a freaking hotfix for this crap and we have to wait a month. It's making the beta completely unplayable at this point.

Extremely aggravating. You can't tell me you can't release a little 2mb or whatever patch to fix this. It should be easy as hell.

BigDov #48 Posted Oct 30 2010 - 18:29

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Ok this can't be a rare bug I am exhibiting with shooting the IS-4, had several games since my last post vs IS-4's, and all the times I have used AP ammo and penetrated I have done no damage, I have even tracked the an IS-4 and still not received any reward for doing so. The only way to deal any sort of damage is to use HE ammo and deal an amazing 1% damage on a critical hit.

Still using the same tank - the vk3601 with the 75mm/L70.

Also in one game it took 6 tanks - 2 of them heavies(Tiger II and IS-3) and 4 mediums(VK's and Panthers) - to get one IS-4 down to 25%, So I don't know what or if there's something wrong with the IS-4, but it shouldn't take 6 tanks just to get one IS-4 down to 25%.

SquartFishy #49 Posted Oct 31 2010 - 20:40

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Rammed my KV1S into SU-5, dropped him to half hp, and fired my 122m D-2-5T point blank, and did zero damage. His buddies blew me up afterwards.

There's also once I fired on a KT from the rear with the same gun on the same tank, 100% crew, roughly 70 meters away, and bounced. I was aiming at its hull. There's also lots of times where penetration does no damage whatsoever.

If the no damage penetration is caused by tank modules soaking up the hit, I really hope they made it so that excessive damage will bleed out and hurt, instead of simply breaking the affected module.

BigDov #50 Posted Nov 03 2010 - 15:25

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Been trying a few games with the VK3601 with the 88mm gun, and still getting the same results when shooting IS series tanks with AP ammo,for instance shot one IS-3 tank 6 times, 2 shots bounced, 4 were critical hits( 2 to the lower front, 2 into the sides/tracks), and the crew said "Critical hit" every time, I even managed to de-track the IS-3 on the 3rd hit, yet still did no damage, and after match report showed that I damaged no tanks yet the 6 hits were recorded. Screen shot of the after match report attached below.

Only seems to effect IS tanks, I can deal damage to tigers, maus's, T-44's but don't get any damage when firing AP ammo at IS-tanks. On a side note, I tested this with the SU-85 with the 107mm gun, and every hit that penetrated an IS-3/4 would deal damage, even dealing 20% on one occasion to a IS-4.

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Thorgald #51 Posted Nov 03 2010 - 16:57

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View PostBigDov, on Nov 03 2010 - 15:25, said:

Been trying a few games with the VK3601 with the 88mm gun,
if you think the 88mm is bad, try the conical, that isn't even penetrating any more.

shot at a T-28 at 0 meters a few times and all of them bounced :)

i want a credit and research XP refund for that gun :/

SylvrDragon #52 Posted Nov 05 2010 - 22:29

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I had two bounces off of a VK3001(H) today from my 7.5cm mounted on my PzIV. I know the 3001(H) is a higher tier tank, but it has 50 armor on front and rear and my 7.5 has a minimum of 97 penetration. So my minimum is nearly double his armor, and we were at short range and I was firing into his rear. Messed up man.

Punik #53 Posted Nov 06 2010 - 22:47

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I confirm this strange behavior on different tanks, most notably PzIII, Tiger I and Stug III. Sometimes, I hear "Ricochet", but have taken fair amount of percent from enemy. Other times - "dinged them", and also scored like 8 - 14 percent, depending on target. And also, the above mentioned "hit them hard" or "critical hit" for zero percent. At least for the critical hit I hope for internal systems/crew injury, but I guess it is just hope. Nothing more. :) I didnt found a common lead yet, but I will try to gather some statistics on used vehicles, guns and ammo. Sorry if this is off-topic, I just thought this could be the appropriate thred to post this weird behavior into. :)

OKamilTan #54 Posted Nov 07 2010 - 04:52

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something strange, with my IS 7 and his 130mm with 260 penetration, i cant penetrate the side of the maus at 20cm who have 160 armour
ive fired more than 10 shells (in multiples games) at the sides and no one have penetrated, and something similar with the turret

Flintwikk #55 Posted Nov 07 2010 - 14:10

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I hope this is the correct place to put this,
While using the Is and the 122mmD25T I sometimes get no hit registration on targets(Stationary on wide variety of tanks/spg's)I aim for the middle of the target and get no hit,this has happened to many times for me to count,I was having the same issues with the 105mm on the JgPanther but have since moved to the Ferdi :).

OKamilTan #56 Posted Nov 07 2010 - 14:36

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remembers somes others things that happens, sometimes when my spg shells are very near mountain or other things, without touch that they simply disappear, no hit, no explosion, just like the Bermuda triangle

Chillin1248 #57 Posted Nov 08 2010 - 19:03

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I have noticed a lot of my arty shells disappearing lately, it seems that they get lagged out of existence.

In other news, I don't even bother aiming for IS3 and above anymore, at least half my shells are guaranteed to bounce in my Tiger 2 with 105mm. I just look for other targets to make money and exp on.

You guys really have to reduce the slope on the IS series, it is getting horrible already.

Flintwikk #58 Posted Nov 10 2010 - 08:46

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Overlord,

Would there be an easy explanation for these disappearing rounds?

bobjoeharris #59 Posted Nov 11 2010 - 16:39

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I was in driving my KV and I shot at a VK4502P frontal armor with stock gun. Did 50% damage and caught him on fire even though the AP indicator was red. There was no gunner voice.

Haineko #60 Posted Nov 12 2010 - 10:10

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Long time ago i fired at a KV-1 with the 75mm and heard the "That one went right through" and doing 0% dmg. Fired again, same. Fired a HE round at the tracks, Nothing.




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