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Why American Heavy Drivers Need To Stop Acting German.


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Gyarados #1 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 14:45

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I've prided myself on being an American heavy tanker for some time now. It was the first Tier X grind I've done post-release, and for the most part, I still enjoy the tanks. They've been the "hard mode" since release up until the release of the French heavy tree, which I do legitimately think is a more difficult line to play.

That being said and done, I've noticed and incredible amount of whining going on about American heavy tanks in general here, when for the most part...they aren't even bad. The T29, T32, and T30 are decent tanks, the two former are great for their tier with the ladder only be adequate depending on the situation. The amount of complaining about the American heavies is a little unwarranted in my honest opinion. I've loved the grind, I've loved playing them post-grind...save for the T34...which isn't as bad as I've made it out to be, but that's only with the 120 and the grind to the 120 is a horror. After some time, I've just grown sick of all of the complaining. You gents need to man up and realize we cannot be like the German heavy tank players, who whine and whine and whine about silly things like "Soviet bias" and "armor" and realize that for the longest time, you were the elite.

Now, I'm not the best American heavy player, although I'll say I'm above average. I have decent stats in the T29, T32, and T30. My stats in the T34 aren't great, but they are still above average (+3% win rate above average if I recall correctly).

The T29 is amazing Tier VII tank, the weaponry on it is fantastic. It has the penetration of the Tiger and some pretty good punch to it as well. The only issue I have with the T29 now is that it's MM values for me are apparently stupid high. I never get into games that aren't Tier IX (As in 3+ Tier IX tanks) or Tier X games. It's making me think about selling the tank to be completely honest, while I can make that work sometimes, it's rather annoying to be facing those tanks when most of them can 3 shot me while it'll take me much more time to kill them. Don't get me wrong, I've done it, but this thing needs to see Tier VII and VIII matches far, far, far more often. My overall stats in the T29, I'm actually rather fond of, there was a point where I was at a 60% win rate, but a massive loss streak at the release of 7.0 kind of made it go down a bit, I've been working on getting it to 60% (same with my Ferdinand).

T29 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T32 is a pretty solid Tier VIII tank. I sold it the first time to afford the T34 because I was impatient, I have since learned my lesson. Prior to 7.0, it was a pretty good all around tank, and it was decently bouncy. The main reason I ended up selling it for a second time before I could much more use in it was that I simply did not care to keep playing the tank anymore, I was getting extremely frustrated (this was also during my massive loss streak) with the vehicle, thus I sold it out of pure rage. I have since played it on the test server and I have to say that it's a pure monster these days. The normalization change makes the T32 nearly as bouncy as the IS-3 and King Tiger are, the poor AMX 50 100 has no hope of bouncing anything (except off the back...which I really haven't understood). It's gun isn't necessarily lack luster for it's tier so much as the accuracy should go up, the 198 penetration will allow you to get through most of the vehicles that you're going to be facing, it's just not as noob friendly as the BL-9 or 10.5cm L/68 (both 225 penetration).

T32 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T34...now that is a hate-hate relationship that I have with that thing. I really do hate the machine with all of my heart and soul, the only reason it's in my garage right now is because I ran into the credits for it at an opportune moment (just before the triples) and because it'll eventually digivolve into an M103. I rarely take this tank out, I mainly only do so when I'm with other Tier IX vehicles, or another T34 since two of them together can do some pretty scary amounts of damage. I will admit I'm also quite bad with the tank because it just simply does not do anything well that I am proficient in. It's a great mid-line support tank...that's now how I play the game. I'm an overly aggressive urban fighter, I hate open maps like Malinovka, Steppes, El Halluf, or Prokhorovka. There are more reasons than that, mainly I still hate high-tier SPGs, but I simply perform better in urban environments. The T34 can do well in those situations, but it can't do a 2v1 like the E-75, VK4502, IS-4, or even (shit howdy!) the AMX 50 120. It's damage output is not decent enough, just giving the damn thing a better engine and more penetration would have made up for it's woes, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we have to have historical accuracy while all other tanks get fantasy gear and prototypes.

T34 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T30, now this tank, this tank is actually okay. It's a horrifying thing to use in public games, but in tank companies and UC, it's a wonderful machine. Now, you might ask why this is, since the E-100 has the same kind of damage output while also having armor. I tell you friend, that is absolutely true, but the E-100 has a few principle disadvantages in comparison to the T30. First and foremost, it's slower, the T30 can peek more effectively, and back out. Second, since the E-100 has more armor, people will try to learn how to fight one, which leads to them getting crippled more often. Third, it's huge, seriously, have you seen one? It's like the Empire State AFV. The size makes it scarier to look at, thus, you want it gone first and it's also much, much, much easier to hit with arty (although the effects between the two may be argued to be decent trade offs). The weapon on the T30 is incredible, the 276mm of penetration means that the T30 can fight effectively in UC without needing APCR, which is not the case with the Maus, and the E-100 practically depends on HEAT. Also, it's sexy, I mean, really, it's almost unfair how gorgeous this tank is. The subtle differences between it and the T29/34 (such as not having the tracks on the hull, or the derpy gun size/color of the T53) make it aesthetic perfection in my personal opinion. I love this tank, even though I rage whenever I use it in a public game, it's the tank that I prefer to play during UC and if I have some friends, I'll always gladly take the T30 into battle.

T30 Stats.

Spoiler                     

Now, the point of this thread was not to sit here stat-jerk myself. The point of this is to show that while the T34 is harder than trigonometry, the overall line is relatively wonderful and rewarding. The next time someone complains about the American heavy line, simply say "I know someone who can stand their own, and they don't need armor to do it, because he's American dammit!"

Other notable American heavy drivers would be FaustianQ, Onyx, JDCollie, and a few others who's name escape me at the time. Of course, there's always VPG's carrier Porc0man who seriously has to fire small children or puppy nightmares, he's just too good with the T30.

ForcestormX #2 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 14:55

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My first grind as well. Proud I played them, and use what I learned to be a terror in the USSR and German trees. T32 is still that one tank I want to buyback when I get the spare creds. I secretly wish for those one-clan-battle days when I play in UC since then there are enough IS7s and I can bring the T30 in battle.

Great tanks, T29 and T32 can both just roflstomp. It's the T34 and the T30 that are really, really finicky and don't leave any margin for error.

No_Ammo #3 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 14:57

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I think the logic is flawed.

useing my t34 as a bright red target. all enemies suddenly take notice of my rapid aproach. in a panic the enemy fires franticly to stop my advancing while the MVP (e75 is4 arty) shoot. this slight of hand turns the tide of war when in the death of the t34 the enemy force finds 1/3 of their tanks destryed (results vary)

why am i gona bother suffering 15mins of bouncing my 105 off everything for the next 300k exp of every round?

as for t32 its a wonderfull assult tank

t29 not so much. that one i play conservitly for best results

i use to think american tanks were fodder, until trying other nations i thought dominated me. i found the american tanks had already molded me to a playing style cadering to the pros and cons of US tanks. however the t34 is a peice of insuferable crap...

ZKaiZ #4 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:01

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Daw, I ain't mentioned for heavy drivers, T.T

Anyway, I love the T34 personally, It makes me good money, and its easy to control, much better then the T30 IMO.

and I also want my T32 back, I love it alot

GoldMountain #5 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:24

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I rush grinded to get to the T34 when i heard that it would be coming in 6.x patch...
I like to think that considering i run on average 12-17fps my stats are more than reasonable
56% win rate in the T34, 50% for T29/T32/T30

Konflict #6 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:34

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Thanks G for the write up.

I am still on the T29 but want to go up the American Heavy Line. So much grinding :(

I took a needed break from the game, pub matches and MM just took a toll on me.

CriticalThinking #7 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:41

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The American heavy line has been fairly enjoyable for me so far(sans the M-6). I liked the T-29, it's definitely a beast, and am currently grinding away on the T-32. I've heard all the horror stories about the T-34, and considering the fact that it gets the T5E1 as a 'mid-level' gun that has carried over from Tier 7, I can see why. I rage quite often when I am a prisoner to WOT circumstances, as one generally finds himself while playing pugs, so I know that the 120mm grind might likely put me with one foot in the grave lol.

The main considerations I am using to stick with the American heavy line are that (1) I am American, and proud (2) the T30 gun looks to be an absolute nightmare for enemy tanks (3) I currently have an E-75, but after much thought, I just can't see myself in an E-100(too big, gun lacks pen).

I do understand that the T-30 is underarmored compared to it's counterparts, however, compared to the Russian and German heavy Tier X's, the T-30's gun has me sold. I am a big fan of TD's; I used them exclusively when I started playing the game for two months. Their superior guns give me a digital hard on. When I heard the T-30 was being moved to a TD I was smitten.

I may sell out and go for the IS-7, because that things just looks sexy. I like the penetration numbers on its gun, but the 490 Alpha has me a little concerned.

Gyarados #8 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:50

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The IS-7 is actually a pretty good tank, the gun's alpha is no issue. I prefer the 750 damage of the T30 as well, though, so I know what you mean.

Gochtune #9 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 15:55

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American Heavy Tank line isn't actually that bad, people are sometimes just exaggerating our of pure rage which is understandable (I'm looking at you T34).
I choose American Heavy line because it's rare to see it. An American heavy tank? They never showed up in WWII, and looks like they're pretty good. So I decided to check it out.

T1 is pretty armored for a tier V heavy, a decent one. People hate it because MM screws up the tank and of course, KV-2 perform far better as a tier V heavy.

M6
, on the other hand is well armored. Coupled with slopes and good positioning, it's good for a tier 6 tank. 90mm is a killer, but of course people hates it because it's facing KV-3, a superior vehicle which is moving up a tier.

T29
... Awwwsuuuummm. MM screws it up after patch 0.7.0, which is making me sad. Well, at least they didn't make the ear a weakspot again...

T32
. Loved it to death, the best tier 8 heavy for me. Nothing performs as good as it is. I somehow sucks hard with King Tiger...

T34
. I FINISHED MAH GRIND WITHOUT PREM! FUUUUUUUUU WG!. Apparently, this tank is inadequate for a tier 9 heavy due to it's lack of early armament, complete sadness and coupled with the driver stress makes this tank a rage-source of US heavies player. Yes... the grind is hard. Gameplay wise, the 120mm is great and I somehow like this tank more than my E-75 because of a few reason. The gun and mobility.

Dunno bout T30.

While I myself is primarily a German heavy tank driver, I rarely whine on forums about my German tanks except Tiger. And I whine before 0.6.4. When Tiger is nothing but a tissue box.

Gyarados #10 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 16:06

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The whole Germany whiney thing was more of a stab pre-6.6 discussions that went on in the German heavy subforum where it was just whine thread after whine thread, while you could visit the other two and get relatively decent conversations out of people. Eventually, people realized the German heavy tanks are have incredible soft and hard stats, making them great tanks for players who are new, since they are probably the easiest line to play.

Kokubukan_Shinano #11 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 16:21

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Absolutely like my T34, Got it way before the intended patch last years.

Other than that, I like the fact it gives me more challenge than driving most tanks. T32 is another tank I like but I sold it for the T34, I do need to buy it back again sometime after getting something else.

The T30, I am scared to get out in pubs but generally I like it as well.

Finally I agree with you Gya. :Smile_honoring:

pyantoryng #12 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 16:24

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I've yet to buy a T29...I'm broke from Frenchies' business.

But T1 and M6's actually not German style sniping...they're better off fighting on the front/second line. From my experience anyways...

Somnus #13 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 18:04

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I've never quite understood the "American heavies suck" line of argument (excepting the T34). The T1 an M6 have only the Soviet KV line to compare to, and it's not so much that the US tanks are bad as that their competitors are OP. The T29 is broadly considered the class of its Tier, and there are constant arguments about whether the T32 is the best Tier 8 (and many who simply feel its just a well-balanced Tier).

The T34 is the standout of badness, but that's just one tank.

Reklaw #14 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 19:20

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T1 - Statistically this is the second worst performing tank in the game, coming in at a global 45.9% win rate. Like most underperforming vehicles, the problem is not the tank itself so much as its matchmaking. It may be almost equal to its peers, but it never sees its peers in batlte.

M6  - Statistically this is THE worst performing tank in the game. Again, 45.9% win rate, global. Again, its matchmaking value is horrendous. Again, it is somewhat weak for its tier. The grind is also somewhat long for its tier. Like the T1, it is awkward and unreliable. It either works somewhat well or is completely ineffective in every way.

T29 - "The King of Tier Seven." Actually, the Tiger P has almost the same exact win rate. It's nowhere near as good as it once was. Nerfs and historical blindfolds have been heaped upon this tank since release, to the point that it is more in line with its peers. It is basically what should have been a tier 8 tank, at tier 7. That should be obvious considering that other than the T32, every single tank in the heavy line is a T29 with a new gun, from this point on.

T32 - Quite possibly the only tank within the entire American heavy tree that feels like it embodies the identity of the line. It is physically weak but has a powerful turret that allows it to make use of its mobility to completely dominate enemies in the right situation. If you know how to use it, it's amazing. If you don't know how to use it, it's frustrating to play and very random. If history wasn't mucking up the game for us, this would be the point where the US tanks start getting 300mm+ turrets and horrible hull armor, and 120mm guns. Unfortunately, history ruins all that and this is the last we see of everything the American heavy line should have been.

T34 - Little needs to be said. It's the worst grind in the game. Due to WG's incompetence and outright greed, a lot of bad feelings are associated with this tank. Even fully elited, it underperforms for its tier, falling a full 3% behind the E-75 and IS-4's win rates. Currently, it falls 7% behind the AMX 120. It is the principle evidence of this game that DPM and heavies with no armor do not mix. If you want to learn how not to make a video game tank, this is it. Even elited, many describe it as the worst tank for its tier in the game. (Although that may have changed since the French lower tiers came out.)

T30 - Terrible in public matches. It's a T29 that deals 750 damage. It has been heavily nerfed, despite having always been the worst tier 10 in the game. Buffs have been heaped upon the other tanks, while the T30 has been punished for seemingly no reason. Historically, the T30 was worse than the T34 because the gun was far too unreliable, as it was a low velocity howitzer. The same idea carries over to WoT. Its low velocity and steep dropoff causes its "high penetration" to drop off dramatically. Its gun is highly prone to unrealistic bounces, ghost rounds, 0 damage hits and extremely high target divergence. You have to work twice as hard as any other tier 10 driver, and even at the peak of the tank, it doesn't exceed the other tier 10s. Unlike the T32, which can outplay its peers if used correctly, the T30 is simply worse, as it is a tier 7 vehicle using a bugged gun. Not a bad tank, but not a very good one, either. Its gun is the only part of the tank that really matters, and it requires the full support of an organized team to work.


Out of the six US heavies, I count two that are good. I count three that are horrible. And I count one that is simply underwhelming. All can achieve a 60% win rate. The problem is the amount of effort you have to expend to get it, compared to the other lines.

You really don't know how bad the whole line is until you play another. It's amazing getting into a high tier German tank for the first time and literally having to do next to nothing. You just drive forward and let your gun do the work for you. Whereas with US tanks you have to sweat at the keyboard just to be competitive, with the other lines, you barely have to think. They are jokes to many and delicious xp targets for all. In a crowd, you are targetted first not because you are the biggest threat, but because you are the easiest to kill and grant the largest personal rewards. US tanks all have a bounty on their heads from the moment they hit the battlefield.

I can go ahead and list the M103 and T110, even without even having played them, just from understanding the game mechanics and knowing the basis of how the tanks will be balanced:

M103 - An awkwardly slow and clunky tank with unreliable armor for its tier. It experiences a long and painful grind to get the M53, which makes the tank worth using. The damage is a little low for its tier, but the gun's penetration allows the M103 to be competitive at tier 10. The rate of fire leaves much to be desired, however, as the amount of damage you perform is low, and the pen overkilsl against many targets, meaning other lesser pen guns that deal more damage actually are more effective in the long run. The M103 is somewhat adequate as a tank, but is ultimately defined by its gun, which is reliable but awkward due to the way you must use it on the tank itself.

T110 - Fast for a heavy but slow for a medium, the T110 has trouble finding its place. It retains the M103's M53, which is its only gun option. The rate of fire increases slightly, but that is all. The T110 itself controls well but has a middling low top speed, meaning its versatility is limited to small engagements. Its very, very low damage makes in incapable of fighting head to head with other tier 10s. While the penetration is technically high, the relative armor of other tier 10s means you will still have to carefully target weak spots or flank to deal damage, unless using gold ammo. The T110, as a result, plays very similarly to a slower, more awkward Patton. Its turret armor is higher than its predecessors but still nowhere enough to deflect rounds with certainty. Its low damage and unreliable defenses and mediocre speed mean the T110 is a jack of all trades that excels at absolutely nothing. Its main competitors, tier 9 mediums and the IS7, perform its various roles with greater efficiency. The T110, as a result, is known for its reliability but the tendency to fall short in any role.

The US heavy line is still the worst class. People thought the French would take over that role, but they've obviously excelled in it, as I predicted. The ability to spike damage is invaluable to a tank with no armor. US tanks technically have more armor, yet it's not high enough to trigger, meaning it's no better than 0 armor. Plus, they cannot condense damage, meaning they have limited functionality. Even the one component that supposedly the US tanks have over other heavies is not true. The large amount of turret armor actually becomes outclassed by other high tier heavies, due to their large base value and high slope. The large amount of penetration and accuracy most guns have also makes it difficult to bounce tier 10 rounds, even with a large amount of mantlet armor. Even gun depression is rarely supported by most maps. When it comes up, the map makers ensure USSR and German tanks can do the same, or none of the nations can. And that's not even touching upon how meaningless going hull down becomes as a tactic in upper tiers.

Even with the new tree changes, the identity of the American heavy tree won't change. It's still the tree that can do anything - just not very well. You can see this in the language of the forums or in-game. US tanks "aren't that bad." American heavies "can be played well." They address the negative reality by default. You never hear "American tanks aren't that overpowered." Nor do you hear such stupid comments as "I wish they'd buff the armor on the lower glacias." They're generally just bad tanks, with two exceptions. They're not unusable, but anything they can do, another heavy can do much better. If you asked a Wargaming employee what a US heavy does that a USSR heavy can't, and he didn't give you some segmented answer like "gun depression" or "better accuracy," he wouldn't be able to provide an honest answer. There is no upside. They're basically training tanks for the other lines.

Landsraad #15 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 19:34

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I've been playing both German heavy lines for a while now, currently I'm at the VK4502B and King Tiger. Then recently I decided to start the American and Russian lines, as well as the French line when it came out.  I'm at the IS-2 and T29, having come over from the Jumbo into the the M6, and I must say that I LOVE the T29 even with just the 90mm.  Don't get me wrong, I really liked my Tiger, the Tiger P was okay, The IS-2 is a blast, and the ARL 44 also fun, but the T29 is just a dream.  The armor, the firepower, the mobility... Sure, with the 90mm it's outclassed in each area by at least one other tier VII heavy; the Tiger is more maneuverable and hasa better gun, the IS-2 seems a bit faster; but it all melds together just right in the T29. This tank just feels RIGHT to me, I've even taken on two other 100% T29s solo and managed to drive away with two kills, there aren't many tanks I can say that about. And the M6 I feel gets a bit of a bad rep.  Don't get me wrong, it doesn't stand up to a KV-3 in raw armor and firepower, and the M1A2 SUUUUUUCKS on it, but it's still a really soild mobile heavy with the 90mm M3.

Batosi #16 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 19:58

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Here is the deal and why there is so much complaining, not whining.  I am not going to take everything apart and go detail by detail but just try and boil it down.  I have been a wargamer going on about 35 years now +/- 1 and what went wrong is very easy to see.

If you study these Tanks and read their background you will see they were built for one purpose and one purpose only.  To be Sniping Tanks, to get their kills from Long Range with highly accurate and penetraiting guns.

But do to how they have been balanced Grinding and MM Tier wise, and into a brawling enviroment, they have been stripped of their essence.  These Tanks are NOT brawlers, were never built for that, but do to being forced into these catagories, they have been nerfed/balanced in such a way that they are no longer T29, T32, T32, T30 but something else what has left us wanting.  The very HEART of what these Tanks are, are no longer there and we have something in name only.

What should have happend is that there should have been 2 Heavy Tank lines and 2 of the 4 Tanks should have been chosen and both have been Tier 8 across from each other and possibly Tier 9 for one of them such as the T34.  The T29 for its Optics and Range Finders for long range sniping and accuracy, the longest range of all the Tanks in the game (basicly the Marder II for the heavies) and the T32 for its tougher and more hard hitting ability.  And from all the reading I have done from all the posters, we have plenty of Tanks to fill in the gap above them in two lines and what we miss, make a paper Tank to fill.

These Tanks have been nerfed to fit an imaganary concept that has taken away from what they are, its like trying to force a Formula 1 racer and a 4X4 to compete against each other in eachs different enviroment.

The Grinding Tiers should just be about grinding and the Match Maker should have done exactly what it was meant to do, BE a Match Maker.  All the Tanks in the game could have kept their essence of what they were meant for and have been balanced in the MM system for fighting and a lot of this crap would have disappeared.  For most of these Tanks were balanced by their Guns alone for the most part, and THAT killed a lot.

WoT has something great on their hands, they just failed in the execution of it.  Its not just the American Heavies that suffer from this though they were probably hit the worst, there are Tanks from other nationalities that have suffered from wrongful execution of game balance too.

And this is not something that is actually hard to fix at all, it just needs some more work and it will add some real longevity to this game once completed.

SFC_Storm #17 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 20:13

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View PostGyarados, on Jan 17 2012 - 14:45, said:

I've prided myself on being an American heavy tanker for some time now. It was the first Tier X grind I've done post-release, and for the most part, I still enjoy the tanks. They've been the "hard mode" since release up until the release of the French heavy tree, which I do legitimately think is a more difficult line to play.

That being said and done, I've noticed and incredible amount of whining going on about American heavy tanks in general here, when for the most part...they aren't even bad. The T29, T32, and T30 are decent tanks, the two former are great for their tier with the ladder only be adequate depending on the situation. The amount of complaining about the American heavies is a little unwarranted in my honest opinion. I've loved the grind, I've loved playing them post-grind...save for the T34...which isn't as bad as I've made it out to be, but that's only with the 120 and the grind to the 120 is a horror. After some time, I've just grown sick of all of the complaining. You gents need to man up and realize we cannot be like the German heavy tank players, who whine and whine and whine about silly things like "Soviet bias" and "armor" and realize that for the longest time, you were the elite.

Now, I'm not the best American heavy player, although I'll say I'm above average. I have decent stats in the T29, T32, and T30. My stats in the T34 aren't great, but they are still above average (+3% win rate above average if I recall correctly).

The T29 is amazing Tier VII tank, the weaponry on it is fantastic. It has the penetration of the Tiger and some pretty good punch to it as well. The only issue I have with the T29 now is that it's MM values for me are apparently stupid high. I never get into games that aren't Tier IX (As in 3+ Tier IX tanks) or Tier X games. It's making me think about selling the tank to be completely honest, while I can make that work sometimes, it's rather annoying to be facing those tanks when most of them can 3 shot me while it'll take me much more time to kill them. Don't get me wrong, I've done it, but this thing needs to see Tier VII and VIII matches far, far, far more often. My overall stats in the T29, I'm actually rather fond of, there was a point where I was at a 60% win rate, but a massive loss streak at the release of 7.0 kind of made it go down a bit, I've been working on getting it to 60% (same with my Ferdinand).

T29 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T32 is a pretty solid Tier VIII tank. I sold it the first time to afford the T34 because I was impatient, I have since learned my lesson. Prior to 7.0, it was a pretty good all around tank, and it was decently bouncy. The main reason I ended up selling it for a second time before I could much more use in it was that I simply did not care to keep playing the tank anymore, I was getting extremely frustrated (this was also during my massive loss streak) with the vehicle, thus I sold it out of pure rage. I have since played it on the test server and I have to say that it's a pure monster these days. The normalization change makes the T32 nearly as bouncy as the IS-3 and King Tiger are, the poor AMX 50 100 has no hope of bouncing anything (except off the back...which I really haven't understood). It's gun isn't necessarily lack luster for it's tier so much as the accuracy should go up, the 198 penetration will allow you to get through most of the vehicles that you're going to be facing, it's just not as noob friendly as the BL-9 or 10.5cm L/68 (both 225 penetration).

T32 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T34...now that is a hate-hate relationship that I have with that thing. I really do hate the machine with all of my heart and soul, the only reason it's in my garage right now is because I ran into the credits for it at an opportune moment (just before the triples) and because it'll eventually digivolve into an M103. I rarely take this tank out, I mainly only do so when I'm with other Tier IX vehicles, or another T34 since two of them together can do some pretty scary amounts of damage. I will admit I'm also quite bad with the tank because it just simply does not do anything well that I am proficient in. It's a great mid-line support tank...that's now how I play the game. I'm an overly aggressive urban fighter, I hate open maps like Malinovka, Steppes, El Halluf, or Prokhorovka. There are more reasons than that, mainly I still hate high-tier SPGs, but I simply perform better in urban environments. The T34 can do well in those situations, but it can't do a 2v1 like the E-75, VK4502, IS-4, or even (shit howdy!) the AMX 50 120. It's damage output is not decent enough, just giving the damn thing a better engine and more penetration would have made up for it's woes, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we have to have historical accuracy while all other tanks get fantasy gear and prototypes.

T34 Stats.

Spoiler                     

The T30, now this tank, this tank is actually okay. It's a horrifying thing to use in public games, but in tank companies and UC, it's a wonderful machine. Now, you might ask why this is, since the E-100 has the same kind of damage output while also having armor. I tell you friend, that is absolutely true, but the E-100 has a few principle disadvantages in comparison to the T30. First and foremost, it's slower, the T30 can peek more effectively, and back out. Second, since the E-100 has more armor, people will try to learn how to fight one, which leads to them getting crippled more often. Third, it's huge, seriously, have you seen one? It's like the Empire State AFV. The size makes it scarier to look at, thus, you want it gone first and it's also much, much, much easier to hit with arty (although the effects between the two may be argued to be decent trade offs). The weapon on the T30 is incredible, the 276mm of penetration means that the T30 can fight effectively in UC without needing APCR, which is not the case with the Maus, and the E-100 practically depends on HEAT. Also, it's sexy, I mean, really, it's almost unfair how gorgeous this tank is. The subtle differences between it and the T29/34 (such as not having the tracks on the hull, or the derpy gun size/color of the T53) make it aesthetic perfection in my personal opinion. I love this tank, even though I rage whenever I use it in a public game, it's the tank that I prefer to play during UC and if I have some friends, I'll always gladly take the T30 into battle.

T30 Stats.

Spoiler                     

Now, the point of this thread was not to sit here stat-jerk myself. The point of this is to show that while the T34 is harder than trigonometry, the overall line is relatively wonderful and rewarding. The next time someone complains about the American heavy line, simply say "I know someone who can stand their own, and they don't need armor to do it, because he's American dammit!"

Other notable American heavy drivers would be FaustianQ, Onyx, JDCollie, and a few others who's name escape me at the time. Of course, there's always VPG's carrier Porc0man who seriously has to fire small children or puppy nightmares, he's just too good with the T30.


Sorry but T30 is bad, it wasnt before but it is bad now...A Tank thats all gun loses its gun`s accuracy + a 15 sec reload=Alot of missed DPM and usually death because when the enemies storm you, you dont have much the Armor to defend yourself. With E75 if you bounce your Ok it can block a ton before it hides.

ALso the T30`s accuracy on the move is really bad.

Im curious how many games the T30 was played pre Movement Nerf.


Batosi is right, in RL these tanks should not ever be within 500m of there targets, they should get extra zoom levels and have the best accuracy in game.

I know alot of german lovers think the Tiger was accurate, and it was, but compared to the US guns of later years it wasnt nearly as accurate, the 90mm m3 hit coke cans at 500m, the 105mm did the same hell the 155mm could hit a a Tank at 1600 yards which for a Howi was amazing. All they were was huge long range gun platforms meant to be either dug in covering there hulls or to use defilade.

The game in general ruins the long range 1500+ meter shots, also it doesnt have enough Defilade areas that are safe because Arty back then was in areas not like snipers...So IMO they did go wrong, US tanks should have weak hulls huge turrets and best in class accuracy with great Pen, also like I said they always had best optics avalible...ALways it was what the US was great at sighting picture, so give the US a 2 more power zoom, or do what they need to do to get into the newer tanks like the M103/T110 but make sure you give them the justice the deserve, back then they were cutting edge and the 120mm could kill ANYTANK ALIVE.

Landsraad #18 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 20:47

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View PostCmd_Storm, on Jan 17 2012 - 20:13, said:

I know alot of german lovers think the Tiger was accurate, and it was, but compared to the US guns of later years it wasnt nearly as accurate, the 90mm m3 hit coke cans at 500m, the 105mm did the same hell the 155mm could hit a a Tank at 1600 yards which for a Howi was amazing.
That's not as impressive as it sounds.  These aren't sniper rifles, they're cannons, just because a coke can disappeared after you shot at it with a 90mm round at 500m doesn't mean it HIT. This is a round larger than the target going at supersonic speeds we're talking about, if it gets anywhere near a target that small while in-flight it's doing some serious damage.  As to the 155mm on the T30, well, if that's a howitzer then I'm the Queen of England.

Reklaw #19 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 21:02

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The 155mm was indeed a low velocity howitzer-type. It was deemed unreliable in real life, and the 120mm-mounted T34 was considered a far more reliable and effective weapon. The 155mm actually had a lot of problems, the least of which not being its inability to produce reliably consistent penetration.

Oh, and when soldiers describe "hitting" the cans, or Nazi helmets, or whatever else, they know the difference. They aren't blowing them over with wind and then high fiving one another about it. US guns really were very accurate. World of Tanks just intentionally got it wrong, along with massive penetration reductions, all in service to the glorious USSR.

Landsraad #20 Posted Jan 17 2012 - 21:06

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Okay then, I'm just a bit skeptical as this is the first I've heard of American guns being so uber-accurate in the late WWII/Korean War era. Though I'll definitely give you that American armament could most certainly outperform Russian guns by a wide margin.

Edit: All right all right! Give me time to admit defeat next time, yeesh.  :rolleyes:

Let me at least say that I can see why accuracy on all guns was reduced in-game.  After all, map sizes are 1x1km at most right now, having that kind of range and accuracy would turn every game into a cluster-... Er, bomb, even at range.  With 500m as "long range" in WoT it makes sense to lower accuracy to compensate, not just on the American tanks but on every tank (there's no way any gun with .38m@100m would ever be accepted by any military).  Also, as specifically to German guns, there are a few breaks from reality here. Many of these weapons weren't made with early-war quality or even made at all, so it makes sense that they would be (relatively) buffed compared to American weapons. Just my two cents.




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