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Why American Heavy Drivers Need To Stop Acting German.


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Gyarados #41 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:38

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View PostSilty, on Jan 18 2012 - 01:14, said:

Like I said earlier in the thread, the IS3 feels like it has more armor than the KT, when I fight it.  I can easily penetrate the KT through the enormous cupola with the US 90mm or Soviet 107mm or 122mm D-25T, but I have yet to find a frontal weakspot on the IS3 penetrable by those guns.  Not to mention that the side of the KT turret is a giant, very easy to penetrate target.

Maybe I'm just missing the obvious frontal weakspots on the IS3?
It's called the front plate. It's not as awesome as everyone makes it out to be. You just need to angle yourself in relation to it.

View PostOnyx, on Jan 18 2012 - 01:27, said:

Gyarados, just stopping in to say...your T34 stats depress me greatly.  I should give you some pointers.
I've tried playing it several different ways, it's just annoying.

_Jayzilla #42 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:40

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All I play are Random Battles with my T30, over 600+ games in random battles. Emotional roller coaster!

__SNIPER__74 #43 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:42

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The only complaints about the US heavy line that I think are valid -

1) Despite it's no armor status the T34 oddly doesn't have the best gun of the tier IX heavies, which it should  - to compensate for it's lack of real frontal armor in most situations ( yeah yeah hull down  blah blah).

2) The introduction of the E-100 has sort of made the T30 moot. WHICH WAS THE POINT, by the way. Per an old Russian interview about the E series, the E-100 was supposed to replace the T30 as "the nuker" of the tier X set. The complaint part here is the massive delay between the introduction of the E-100, and the introduction of the T30's American replacement, the T110. I mean, it's going to be like 6 months + or so between these two events (or more? I've lost track).

ramp4ge #44 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:42

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I'm going to go to hell for saying this..

But I like my T34. >_>

Onyx #45 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:46

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View Postramp4ge, on Jan 18 2012 - 01:42, said:

I'm going to go to hell for saying this..

But I like my T34. >_>

Oh, the T34 may be going to hell, but I'm going to take the enemy team with me!

SFC_Storm #46 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 01:54

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View PostLandsraad, on Jan 17 2012 - 20:47, said:

That's not as impressive as it sounds.  These aren't sniper rifles, they're cannons, just because a coke can disappeared after you shot at it with a 90mm round at 500m doesn't mean it HIT. This is a round larger than the target going at supersonic speeds we're talking about, if it gets anywhere near a target that small while in-flight it's doing some serious damage.  As to the 155mm on the T30, well, if that's a howitzer then I'm the Queen of England.


Sorry but thats wrong, They hit a man sized target in a free floating target....Meaning there was no backstop at all, so the explosion did nothing, it was either hit or miss and out of 10 rounds they hit 8, They were simply very very accurate, and the 90mm M36 was even more so, it hit Bottles hanging on string.

ALso the 155mm Howi was that accurate, it used diff ammo obviously, but hit 7/10 at 1800 meters....All of the accuracy was from counter weight of platform, also stance, and how the tank takes recoil, inaccurate guns are machined badly with deformities, our guns were superb. Also Optics=Accuracy and with way better optics than the rest its easy to see why its so accurate.

There is no debating the US tanks esp 1945-1954 were the most accurate by far.

SFC_Storm #47 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 02:23

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View PostJDCollie, on Jan 17 2012 - 23:58, said:

I think Onyx, Mow_Mow (another great US player) and I have an advantage in that, as far as I know, all of us really enjoy our T34s (and one could argue, for good or bad, the T34 is essentially the ultimate distillation of the US heavy line). The enjoyment itself isn't specifically an advantage, but it is indicative of an underlying trait: The US tank line fits our playstyles very very well.

With Mow and Onyx, it is because they are incredibly skilled at using tanks to their full potential; they figured out how to play US tanks, and then applied that knowledge gleefully. In my case it is simply because US heavies are all I have really played.



What does this mean? It means that US heavies, as Gyarados has explained, don't actually suck. They just apparently require a very different approach from what is normal for other heavies.


(I haven't talked much to FaustianQ, so I don't know if he likes his T34 or not :P )

The T34 has actually grown on me, I do very well in it now that I have the 120mm, before not at all.

But Its my personal choice to like it, I can definately see how its garbage to alot of people who are hardchargers.

Since my 120, I have gotten prob as a avg 800-820 EXP with 10 hits per match, also I have gotten 3 kills very very often.

Its very fun tank, but I cant say its great just because I learned now how to play it well, I am SOOOOO excited to make it my money maker though I cant even tell you, my Lowe [that was bought with CW gold] is seriously a chore to drive, im good with making creds but its simply a horrible exp. The T34 will be great fun it looks like.

Im hoping the M103 is just able to be used more on offense and will require a tad less effort each match, also it might have a place in smaller CW battles, or as a backup CW tank.

Im ashamed to say I love it now, thats not to say its the best, but it is a rush knowingyou make a mistaje you die fast...It really does make you a better tanker. But once more AVG players deserve more.

_Jayzilla #48 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 02:30

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View PostCmd_Storm, on Jan 18 2012 - 01:54, said:

Sorry but thats wrong, They hit a man sized target in a free floating target....Meaning there was no backstop at all, so the explosion did nothing, it was either hit or miss and out of 10 rounds they hit 8, They were simply very very accurate, and the 90mm M36 was even more so, it hit Bottles hanging on string.

ALso the 155mm Howi was that accurate, it used diff ammo obviously, but hit 7/10 at 1800 meters....All of the accuracy was from counter weight of platform, also stance, and how the tank takes recoil, inaccurate guns are machined badly with deformities, our guns were superb. Also Optics=Accuracy and with way better optics than the rest its easy to see why its so accurate.

There is no debating the US tanks esp 1945-1954 were the most accurate by far.


I agree, and yet they nerf the T30s accuracy by messing up its desperation.

Blaze200 #49 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 02:34

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View Postramp4ge, on Jan 18 2012 - 01:42, said:

I'm going to go to hell for saying this..

But I like my T34. >_>
With 448 battles in T34 I have to agree. Stock it was the worst thing ever but upgrades there is just something about it I like. On the other hand I didnt like T32 much, sure when top tier its fine but I dont like fighting tier9s with such a terrible gun let alone tier10s. Though I grinded through T32 while its gun depression was nerfed.

Onyx #50 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 02:43

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View PostJayzilla, on Jan 18 2012 - 02:30, said:

I agree, and yet they nerf the T30s accuracy by messing up its desperation.

That doesn't mess up its accuracy so much as its time-on-target.  The .35 accuracy messes up its accuracy, though...

The time-on-target, though, does heavily impact the tank.

Gyarados #51 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 02:55

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I never really noticed the difference, but again, I didn't get much of a chance to really get to know the T30 before the changes. I've done fairly well in it after the changes still, but that's also mainly being used in UC, tank companies, or the occasional Tier X rape squadron.

_Jayzilla #52 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 03:14

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View Postramp4ge, on Jan 18 2012 - 00:37, said:

The difference between German complaints and US complaints is that the US complaints have some justification and more often then not the complaints come in a tongue-in-cheek kind of way.

The biggest issue with US tanks is that they have strengths, but to make up for those strengths they have GLARING, HUGE weaknesses. Like the T32. Great hull, fantastic turret, and a popgun. IS-3 and KT have great hulls, great turrets and death rays.. Or the T29/34/30. Good guns, paper hulls. Nobody else has to deal with that. Germans get good armor and great guns pretty much forever, Russians get great guns and good armor at most of their tiers..US tanks tend to pay for improved firepower with reduced protection. Now with the Frogs in the game suffering pretty much the same thing, we'll see how that goes. Only problem there is, while Frogs suffer the same lack of hull armor that generally plagues the US tree, they get even better guns...

You know what I'd give for a 230 pen 240 damage 90-100mm gun on the T32? Or even better, the Persh?

US is that route that you play just to be different. You don't want to play Germans or Russians because those are the "expected" things to do. All I play is US tanks anymore and have absolutely 0 desire to play Russian, German or French. I might play British, but we'll see.

Overall, there's a stark difference in the mindsets you compare. Like NF used to be, I tend to see the German subforum as a dark, damp cave full of "Woe is me!" posters. I don't see that in the US subforum.

I have similar mentality, I refuse to play Russian Tanks, I have meddled around with German tanks. Overall I do agree with you on the part of all the setbacks and limits the US line currently faces. I played my T32 when they nerfed the gun depression, and it was just horrifying. I hated the 105mm gun for having such a ridiculous 198mm penetration. But I just had to suck it up and played its advantages. It just doesn't make any sense for all the US players who have worked towards their tanks to be told that they will be getting similar tanks in the later teirs (i.e. T29,T34,T30).

All I play are random battles, and every time I see a line of T30s and T34s against IS7s, E100s, E75s, and IS4s, the entire team knows the undertone of "Oh great, this battle is going to suck." If ever that battle was won, it was always hard fought and many times a fluke.

I am sure we have turned away would-be US tankers away by the amount of disadvantages we advertise of our tanks.

Simply put, I am just patiently waiting for the day where WG.net allows for a solid US tank that we all can be proud of.

_Jayzilla #53 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 03:17

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View PostOnyx, on Jan 18 2012 - 02:43, said:

That doesn't mess up its accuracy so much as its time-on-target.  The .35 accuracy messes up its accuracy, though...

The time-on-target, though, does heavily impact the tank.


My mistake, but you understand the amount of time you have to expose yourself to dial in the shot. That alone gets very frustrating, on top of that, you aim for a center mass target, know the shell drop over the distance only to have a complete miss or a ghost shot.

SFC_Storm #54 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 05:29

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View PostOnyx, on Jan 18 2012 - 02:43, said:

That doesn't mess up its accuracy so much as its time-on-target.  The .35 accuracy messes up its accuracy, though...

The time-on-target, though, does heavily impact the tank.



nO IT DOES MESS UP ACCURACY WHEN YOU ARE TRACKING TARGETS, WHICH IS 50% OF THE TIME IN GAME

hiroshi_tea #55 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 05:44

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lol, watch out for the caps CMD.

Also,
I'm upset that I'm not on this list of good US tankers :(

KnightFandragon #56 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 05:49

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View Posthiroshi_tea, on Jan 18 2012 - 05:44, said:

lol, watch out for the caps CMD.

Also,
I'm upset that I'm not on this list of good US tankers :(

Lol, just assume you are one of the tankers whom he couldnt recall the name of +D

Onyx #57 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 05:57

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View PostJayzilla, on Jan 18 2012 - 03:14, said:

I have similar mentality, I refuse to play Russian Tanks, I have meddled around with German tanks. Overall I do agree with you on the part of all the setbacks and limits the US line currently faces. I played my T32 when they nerfed the gun depression, and it was just horrifying. I hated the 105mm gun for having such a ridiculous 198mm penetration. But I just had to suck it up and played its advantages. It just doesn't make any sense for all the US players who have worked towards their tanks to be told that they will be getting similar tanks in the later teirs (i.e. T29,T34,T30).

All I play are random battles, and every time I see a line of T30s and T34s against IS7s, E100s, E75s, and IS4s, the entire team knows the undertone of "Oh great, this battle is going to suck." If ever that battle was won, it was always hard fought and many times a fluke.

I am sure we have turned away would-be US tankers away by the amount of disadvantages we advertise of our tanks.

Simply put, I am just patiently waiting for the day where WG.net allows for a solid US tank that we all can be proud of.

Oh, of this it is certain.  The general negative tone towards US tanks turns away people just as the "russian bias" myth draws people towards The USSR tanks.

Just don't ever, ever say I am a detriment to my team when I'm in a T34.  Ever.

With proper support (As in, I'm not frontlining against them exclusively) the T34 tears those tanks apart.

View PostCmd_Storm, on Jan 18 2012 - 05:29, said:

nO IT DOES MESS UP ACCURACY WHEN YOU ARE TRACKING TARGETS, WHICH IS 50% OF THE TIME IN GAME


I didn't notice a problem when tracking targets.  I also know how to move my aim slower for long range targets and know how to set up my aim to ambush targets instead of trying to lead them as they pass by, effectively.

Mow_Mow #58 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 06:00

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View Posthiroshi_tea, on Jan 18 2012 - 05:44, said:

lol, watch out for the caps CMD.

Also,
I'm upset that I'm not on this list of good US tankers :(

Well, if you're not good enough, I'm not even close, so don't feel too bad :)

Onyx #59 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 06:02

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View PostMow_Mow, on Jan 18 2012 - 06:00, said:

Well, if you're not good enough, I'm not even close, so don't feel too bad :)

Your stats outdo mine in many regards and yet I still got a mention.

Clearly my being mentioned is because of my signature.

JDCollie #60 Posted Jan 18 2012 - 06:07

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View Posthiroshi_tea, on Jan 18 2012 - 05:44, said:

lol, watch out for the caps CMD.

Also,
I'm upset that I'm not on this list of good US tankers :(
You, VirgilHilts, and ZKaiZ (there are others too) also fall in the good US tankers list. (you're certainly better at it than I am :P )

If nothing else, the people listed in this thread warrant mention because they have been steadfast defenders of the US heavy line for some time now.



Damnation. I need a cooler signature.




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